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Author Topic: Australian Election - Howard wins!!! Hooray
Save Timber Wolves
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posted 10 October 2004 02:03 AM      Profile for Save Timber Wolves     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
John Howard, Liberal Party candidate and strong ally for a freer and better world, handily defeated Mark Latham in an October 9, 2004 Election.

Howard wins his place in history
By Kerry-Anne Walsh

Exerpt follows:

Prime Minister John Howard swept the Coalition to a fourth term last night, cementing his place in Australian history and banishing Labor to another period in the political wilderness.

A grim-faced Labor leader, Mark Latham, conceded defeat just after 9.30pm as Labor struggled across the country to lift its primary vote above a dismal 39 per cent.

And to tumultuous cheers and applause, the fourth-term exuberant Prime Minister claimed victory at 10.40pm, declaring that Australia had not seen such an "extraordinary" electoral feat since the 1960s.

"Can I say first of all that I am truly humbled by this extraordinary expression of confidence in the leadership of this great nation by the Coalition," Mr Howard, flanked by his wife Janette and their children, told the 800-strong crowd of supporters at Sydney's Wentworth Hotel.

Australia stood on the threshold of "a new era of great achievement" and could achieve "anything it wanted", the Prime Minister said - seemingly close to tears.

The swing to the Government in what was expected to be a tightly fought contest, but ended up being a comfortable victory, was about 2 per cent on a two-party preferred basis. It was helped by preferences from the right-wing Family First Party, first-time entrants to the political arena whose strong vote suggests that the "religious right" has arrived in Australia.

[ 10 October 2004: Message edited by: Save Timber Wolves ]


From: Ottawa | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
Mandos
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posted 10 October 2004 02:07 AM      Profile for Mandos   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
In other news, I just ate a spoonful of sugarless strawberry jam. Truly a triumph of the human spirit that shall be remembered throughout the ages. It took a great deal of resolve to eat that spoonful.
From: There, there. | Registered: Jun 2001  |  IP: Logged
Save Timber Wolves
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posted 10 October 2004 02:48 AM      Profile for Save Timber Wolves     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Mandos:
In other news, I just ate a spoonful of sugarless strawberry jam. Truly a triumph of the human spirit that shall be remembered throughout the ages. It took a great deal of resolve to eat that spoonful.

And that's supposed to mean???


From: Ottawa | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
Socrates
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posted 10 October 2004 03:07 AM      Profile for Socrates   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Basically STW, it means that you're either being so sarcastic we missed it, a total troglydyte troll or else you're quite the true believer.

You're post made me want to wretch, i believe that the same feeling was evoked in Mandos.

Please tell us you were joking.


From: Viva Sandinismo! | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
Mandos
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posted 10 October 2004 03:17 AM      Profile for Mandos   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Socrates, do you like sugarless jam? Unfortunately the brand I recently bought uses Splenda to replace sugar, and I don't like Splenda's funny aftertaste. I like my sugarless jam to be actually sugarless and consist mainly of strawberries.

I am now folding and putting away my recently washed clothes! It is a truly great moment for the human race. In another half an hour another great moment will be achieved, as I go to sleep for about 5 hours or so. It brings tears to my eyes the confidence my neurons have in me!


From: There, there. | Registered: Jun 2001  |  IP: Logged
NDP Newbie
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posted 10 October 2004 03:46 AM      Profile for NDP Newbie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Long live Howard, the marginally lesser of two evils, but still far more evil than the Greens!

Labour appears to be a party of far-right Christofascists hiding in the closet of centrism and social democracy.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200410/s1216882.htm

Vic Labour gave its preferences to the FAR-FUCKING-RIGHT over the Greens.

Family First is worse than the most extreme of Bush's supporters!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_First_Party
If there's a neo-Nazi traitor somewhere in Labour, I suggest Latham and co. ruin his personal and professional life forever.


From: Cornwall, ON | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
Agent 204
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posted 10 October 2004 11:09 AM      Profile for Agent 204   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
It doesn't necessarily mean that Labour is a party of "far-right Christofascists"; it might simply mean that they think that far-right Christofascists are strategically useful to them. If Family First senators held the balance of power, it might put Howard in an awkward spot, since he'd have to appease them and at the same time avoid going too far. I don't approve of doing this (I'm not that Macchiavellian ) but the principle of charity demands that we consider this as a possible explanation.

In any case, I have a lot fewer regrets about not emigrating to Australia than I did ten years ago.


From: home of the Guess Who | Registered: Nov 2003  |  IP: Logged
Screaming Lord Byron
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posted 10 October 2004 06:23 PM      Profile for Screaming Lord Byron     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Can I get my Kool-Aid back, STW?
From: Calgary | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 10 October 2004 07:21 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
In other news, I just ate a spoonful of sugarless strawberry jam. Truly a triumph of the human spirit that shall be remembered throughout the ages. It took a great deal of resolve to eat that spoonful.

I had an nice Pelee Island Chardonnay last night.


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
candle
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posted 10 October 2004 11:11 PM      Profile for candle     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well at least Peter Garrett won his seat - albeit in one of the safest Labour seats in the country. He did improve the Labour result though.

http://www.undercover.com.au/news/2004/oct04/20041010_petergarrett.html


From: Ontario | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
Save Timber Wolves
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posted 11 October 2004 12:30 AM      Profile for Save Timber Wolves     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Socrates:
Basically STW, it means that you're either being so sarcastic we missed it, a total troglydyte troll or else you're quite the true believer.

You're post made me want to wretch, i believe that the same feeling was evoked in Mandos.

Please tell us you were joking.


I'm not joking. What we need is a strong policy that unites English speaking democracies in ways that enhances world peace.


From: Ottawa | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
Socrates
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posted 11 October 2004 12:38 AM      Profile for Socrates   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
And the giant Mess-o-potamia (the Iraq war) helped world peace how exactly????

quote:
strong ally for a freer and better world
???


I mean come on.


From: Viva Sandinismo! | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
Save Timber Wolves
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posted 11 October 2004 01:06 AM      Profile for Save Timber Wolves     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Socrates:
And the giant Mess-o-potamia (the Iraq war) helped world peace how exactly????

I mean come on.


I at least enjoy the pun. Seriously, though, the world does not have to be lead around by the nose by some people who are in the 9th Century. I mean, come on. Beheadings?


From: Ottawa | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
Raos
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posted 11 October 2004 01:14 AM      Profile for Raos     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I think I know less about Australia than I thought. Who was advocating beheading people?
From: Sweet home Alaberta | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 11 October 2004 09:17 AM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Beheadings? The C9?

STW, you have missed a whole lot of European history if you have to go that far back to find a beheading.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
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posted 11 October 2004 09:50 AM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Save Timber Wolves:
I'm not joking. What we need is a strong policy that unites English speaking democracies in ways that enhances world peace.

What does English-speaking have to do with anything?


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Willowdale Wizard
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posted 11 October 2004 09:55 AM      Profile for Willowdale Wizard   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
What does English-speaking have to do with anything?

agreed. if anything, australia needs to seriously engage with democratic forces in malaysia and indonesia as regional neighbours.


From: england (hometown of toronto) | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
NDP Newbie
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posted 11 October 2004 03:24 PM      Profile for NDP Newbie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I agree. Australia should pour tons of money into Malaysia's social-democratic, pro-racial equality, anti-Islamist Democratic Action Party. :-)

(Not that the Chinese in Malaysia deserve our help: They're treated like second-class citizens in their own country, only to turn around and be the ultra-homophobic shit stain on the Anglican Communion. All Han, particularly the unenlightened retrogrades in Singapore, Malaysia, and the PRC, must learn the fundamental truths from their progressive-minded compatriots of the Hong Kong and Taiwanese democratic left, as they follow in the glorious footsteps of Dr. Sun Yat-sen. White Man's Burden was the ultimate lie, Progressive Man's Burden is God's only truth.)

That being said, more proof that Labour and the Aussie Democrats are run by the far-right: Senate Results

[ 11 October 2004: Message edited by: NDP Newbie ]


From: Cornwall, ON | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
'lance
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posted 11 October 2004 03:51 PM      Profile for 'lance     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
All Han, particularly the unenlightened retrogrades in Singapore, Malaysia, and the PRC, must learn the fundamental truths from their progressive-minded compatriots of the Hong Kong and Taiwanese democratic left, as they follow in the glorious footsteps of Dr. Sun Yat-sen. White Man's Burden was the ultimate lie, Progressive Man's Burden is God's only truth.

NDP Newbie, if the only problem with this statement was that it read like some kind of badly-translated revolutionary tract, there would be no problem. It would be sort of funny ("the glorious footsteps of Dr. Sun Yat-sen"? Given that he's been dead for over seventy-five years, we'll all be following in his glorious footsteps sooner or, for preference, later).

But "all Han must learn," etc.? Do you really want to be making ethnic generalizations of this kind?

Edit:

Oh, and "Save Timber Wolves"? It's becoming tedious, spotting your latest incarnation. Come up with a new variation on the theme, won't you, there's a good chap.

[ 11 October 2004: Message edited by: 'lance ]


From: that enchanted place on the top of the Forest | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
NDP Newbie
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posted 11 October 2004 05:40 PM      Profile for NDP Newbie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Sorry.

When I think about the extreme social conservatism of China and Singapore, not to mention their inegalitarian mix of dirigisme and free-market capitalism, I get disgusted knowing that there are culturally similar people far more progressive than they are just a stone's throw away.


From: Cornwall, ON | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
'lance
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posted 11 October 2004 05:47 PM      Profile for 'lance     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Fair enough. But "culture" doesn't determine "progressiveness" or lack of same. At least, culture is so broad and general a category that any such claim can't really be meaningful.
From: that enchanted place on the top of the Forest | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
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posted 11 October 2004 07:19 PM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Australian gays fear massive swing to the right following election

[ 11 October 2004: Message edited by: Hephaestion ]


From: goodbye... :-( | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Wilf Day
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posted 11 October 2004 09:54 PM      Profile for Wilf Day     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
There's something wrong with that story, which says
quote:
Among the Family First candidates elected was anti-gay campaigner Michael Ferguson in Bass who told supporters his success was "ordained by Jesus".

The Australian Broadcasting Corporation says:

Michael Ferguson LIB 25,532 49.3
Michelle O'Byrne ALP 20,421 39.4
Jeremy Ball GRN 4,040 7.8
Christine Bergman FFP 917 1.8

ABC Predicted final result: LIB GAIN FROM ALP
LIB 52.9
ALP 47.1

ALP = Australian Labor Party
FFP = Family First Party.

[ 11 October 2004: Message edited by: Wilfred Day ]


From: Port Hope, Ontario | Registered: Oct 2002  |  IP: Logged
NDP Newbie
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posted 12 October 2004 12:07 AM      Profile for NDP Newbie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Depending on how the preferences flow, Family First, a party so extreme that it makes One Nation look like the NDP, could win as many of 3 Senate seats -- In Queensland, South Australia, and due to the fact that the so-called social liberal Democrats and so-called social democratic Labour choce to preference them above the Greens in some states.

Just how crazy are these Nazis?

Joyce's comments came in response to an incident where a Family First supporter said that lesbians were "witches who should be burned at the stake" and an incident in which eggs were thrown at Greens supporters[5] (http://www.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,4057,10967999%255E1702,00.html). Family First deny any involvement in egging the Green volunteers, and have disciplined the supporter responsible for the "witches" statement.

Joyce also pointed to a pamphlet published by the party's Victorian Senate candidate Danny Nalliah stating that, among other things, mosques and Buddhist and Hindu temples were Satan's strongholds and that people should pray for their destruction. Mason, the party's leader, also struck out against the Greens, stating, that "The Greens and Democrats policies aim to remove discrimination against what they term as LGBTI people...they want to see that transvestites and others have the right to teach our children"(Sydney Morning Herald).

Family First's uncompromising attitudes towards homosexuality were also demonstrated in their direction of preferences in the 2004 election. While Family First directed their preferences to the conservative Coalition ahead of Labor, they reversed this in the seats of Brisbane and Leichhardt because Ingrid Tall (Liberal candidate for Brisbane) is lesbian, and Warren Entsch (Liberal for Leichhardt) supports gay marriage. In contrast, a Liberal MP who admitted to having an affair while his wife was pregnant received Family First's preferences over Labor[6] (http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2004/10/05/1096871859778.html?oneclick=true).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_First_Party

Beware: A far-right cabal, likely affiliated with the GOP, the Jiang family, and the Saud family, has taken control of Labour and the Democrats as insurance should Labour win either House, hence these Satan-inspired preferences dealers: Their goal is the outright destruction of personal freedom and social equality in Australia.


From: Cornwall, ON | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
NDP Newbie
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posted 12 October 2004 02:52 AM      Profile for NDP Newbie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
A better summary of the Fascist Crisis that I just wrote out:

If you're not straight, not Christian, or not White and you live in Australia, you'd better be on high alert, as the far-right Family First (For those, like myself, who are more well-versed in North American than Australia, think of a party where everybody is more right-wing and more theocracy-minded than Jerry Falwell, and you'll understand just how bad this situation could be.) may be holding the balance of power in the Senate, thanks to the actions of a far-right cabal that has taken over the Aussie Democrats and Labour in some states, getting the parties to preference Family First over the Greens.

I hope Mr. Latham is happy that he may have turned Australia into a giant concentration camp for thousands of people.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_First_Party
http://www.abc.net.au/elections/federal/2004/guide/senatetickets.htm

These people (if they are indeed worthy of being afforded the dignity of humanity) make Austria's Joerg Haider look like an anarcho-socialist.

And apparently, the higher-ups in Labour (part of a fascist infiltration of the party) seem to think it'll be easier to work with the neo-Nazis than with the Greens.

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2004/10/11/1097406500736.html?oneclick=true

Apparently Family First is almost guaranteed one seat and has an outside chance of picking up as many as two more:

http://afr.com/articles/2004/10/12/1097406547413.html

[ 12 October 2004: Message edited by: NDP Newbie ]


From: Cornwall, ON | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
Mr. Magoo
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posted 12 October 2004 10:32 AM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Sure you still want Proportional Representation??
From: `,_,`,_,,_,, | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
Agent 204
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posted 12 October 2004 11:03 AM      Profile for Agent 204   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
WTF?? That's crazy. The article in the Age didn't go into enough detail about why Labour and the Democrats would do something like this, though, other than to say that "Mr Locke also denied it would be easier for Labor to work with the Greens in the upper house." And I thought the Democrats were fairly progressive- what's gotten into them?

As regards Magoo's question, I still think PR is the way to go. At least under PR there's no way those freaks could ever get a majority. They might hold the balance of power, but surely no reasonable government would work with them for too long... would they?

[ 12 October 2004: Message edited by: Mike Keenan ]


From: home of the Guess Who | Registered: Nov 2003  |  IP: Logged
Mr. Magoo
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posted 12 October 2004 11:26 AM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
As regards Magoo's question, I still think PR is the way to go. At least under PR there's no way those freaks could ever get a majority.

Under FPTP they probably wouldn't even get a seat. Although they might get $1.75 per vote.

Sadly, giving a "voice" to fringe, leftwing KooKs also means giving a voice to fringe, rightwing KooKs.


From: `,_,`,_,,_,, | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
Briguy
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posted 12 October 2004 11:54 AM      Profile for Briguy     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
A few John Howard links.

John Howard Lies

Defeat Howard

John Howard's official website

Biased? Moi?


From: No one is arguing that we should run the space program based on Physics 101. | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
NDP Newbie
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posted 12 October 2004 02:08 PM      Profile for NDP Newbie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The Greens are left-wing kooks?

Their positions on human rights. No different from the NDP.

Their disdain for the growing sphere of influence of both America and China. No different from the NDP.

Their concern for the environment and for sustainable development. No different from the NDP.

Their support for economic democracy and their wariness of mult-nationals and unfair free trade argeements. You get my fucking point. :-)

There's nothing wrong with PR. The problem lies in Australia's bizarre preference system and the tendency of parties to exploit it through preference trading in an attempt to distort the intentions of voters, all in the name of increasing their own power.

Better system of PR: Every Senator runs for (re)-election at the same time and all preferences are decide by the individual voter rather than by parties.

[ 12 October 2004: Message edited by: NDP Newbie ]


From: Cornwall, ON | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
Mr. Magoo
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posted 12 October 2004 02:12 PM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
The Greens are left-wing kooks?

Didn't say that, but since you mention it, they seem a bit flaky! If there weren't some flaky in there then the NDP could just assimilate them and be done with it, eh?

Meanwhile though, PR is often touted as being more democratic because it gives voice to more "out there" parties than FPTP does, and this is typically held up as a good thing. I'm just noting that while some babblers might feel that a far left party "needs to be heard", the far right parties get to be heard too.


From: `,_,`,_,,_,, | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
NDP Newbie
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posted 12 October 2004 02:31 PM      Profile for NDP Newbie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
1. I was referring to the democratic socialist Aussie Greens, I know that our Greens are a socially liberal eco-capitalist party and I disagree strongly with their all-carrot no-stick approach to dealing with environmental issues as they relate to free enterprise.

2. The far-right would not does as well as the "far"-left in Australia (I'd personally equate parties like Family First to authoritarian communism more than I would equate them to social democracy or even democratic socialism): If Australia were to scrap the preference system and go to a 5 or even 3% quota, One Nation would win about 2 seats (or 0 with a 5% quota), while Family First and the Christian Democrats (both far-right parties) would win none.

The Greens would pick up 5 - 10% of the vote and end up with between 4 and 8 Senate seats. (Give or take 1 due to the system's being state-by-state)


Similarly, our Christian Heritage Party, which has similar views to these two Christofascist hate cults, would not be able to do much of anything with its paltry 0.3% vote share, while the NDP and the Greens would siphon off a huge chunk of the Liberal and Red Tory vote (assuming the latter isn't entirely Liberal nowadays) and fare extremely well: Possibly even well enough to form a majority coalition of the left if the Greens were willing to add some stick to their carrot, the NDP and the Bloc were willing to put more resources into preventive health care, and both parties were willing to support a more decentralised confederation in exchange for Bloc Qubcois support. (Regardless of what some may think, Duceppe is still the most leftist mainstream politician in Canada and would be far more in his element working with other progressive-minded parties to build a centre-left consensus rather than forming an alliance of convenience with the likes of Stephen Harper in attempt to bring down our current government.)


From: Cornwall, ON | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged

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