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Author Topic: Study: married men earn more if wives do the chores
Hephaestion
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posted 22 June 2005 08:58 AM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
(London) Married men earn more than bachelors so long as their wives stay at home doing the housework, according to a report on Wednesday from Britain's Institute for Social and Economic Research (ISER).

Academics Elena Bardasi and Mark Taylor found that a married man whose wife does not go out to work but is primarily responsible for the cooking and cleaning earns about 3 percent more than comparably employed single men.

But that wage premium disappears if wives go out to work themselves or don't do most of the housework.

"It has been fairly well documented that married men earn more than single men," Taylor, a labour economist, told Reuters.

"However, our research established the wage premium is related to the wife doing the chores," said the academic who teaches at the University of Essex.

He said analysis suggests there could be two explanations for the results:

A marriage might allow a husband and wife to focus their activities on tasks to which they are most suited. Traditionally, this would result in the man concentrating on paid work enabling him to increase productivity and in consequence his wages.

Taylor said another explanation could be that marriage may increase the amount of time a man has to hone work-related skills which could trigger higher wages.


[ 22 June 2005: Message edited by: Hephaestion ]


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Anchoress
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posted 22 June 2005 09:05 AM      Profile for Anchoress     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Another possibility is that married men whose wives stay home and do chores are less likely to show up to work with buttons missing, egg on a tie or crooked trouser creases. Also they probably get more regular haircuts and are more likely to find out before leaving home that their fly's undone or they're bleeding from a shaving accident. That should be worth a whopping 3% more, shouldn't it?
From: Vancouver babblers' meetup July 9 @ Cafe Deux Soleil! | Registered: Nov 2003  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 22 June 2005 09:21 AM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
In other news: world still round (well, pretty much, maybe a bit flat on both ends), water still wet, and no evidence yet found of green cheese on moon.

This fact -- this undeniable fact -- was part of the basic logic of women's struggles in the 1970s and 1980s to change family law in Canada so that women would not be impoverished upon divorce. That women contribute to a marriage even if they are not making deposits to a bank account was a fact not at all apparent to our law-makers and courts until a critical number of women finally started forcing the issue.


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brebis noire
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posted 22 June 2005 09:22 AM      Profile for brebis noire     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I know for a fact I'd earn at least 3% more if I had a wife around to do the chores.
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skdadl
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posted 22 June 2005 09:27 AM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 

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Bookish Agrarian
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posted 22 June 2005 09:35 AM      Profile for Bookish Agrarian   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
A friend of ours was doing a slow burn when this self-righteous prig was going on and on about how he had gotten his Masters and if women would only do that they could earn more yada, yada, yada. It was one of those work/social situations were it's hard to really give someone the royal kiss off.
So she politely asked him who looked after the kids and did the work around the house while he was working so hard getting his Masters. "Oh my wife did", he said. She then politely asked "Where would I get one of those?" Shut him up for the rest of the night.

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Bookish Agrarian
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posted 22 June 2005 09:46 AM      Profile for Bookish Agrarian   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by skdadl:
This fact -- this undeniable fact -- was part of the basic logic of women's struggles in the 1970s and 1980s to change family law in Canada so that women would not be impoverished upon divorce. That women contribute to a marriage even if they are not making deposits to a bank account was a fact not at all apparent to our law-makers and courts until a critical number of women finally started forcing the issue.

And it is this attitude (the one being fought that is) that also caused the double-edged sword for working women of getting paid less. The husband was the 'real breadwinner', so it's okay to pay women less because they are just here for spending money. It meant women were in a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. I remember my Mom being left out of training session when she started pushing the issue in early 70s. That way they could pretend it was because the men were more highly 'trained'. Of course the fact she wasn't allowed to go and they were doing the same job as her when they got back was totally irrelevant for the employer. That was until my Mom finaly had enough and forced, and I do mean forced, the Union to join in her fight.

[ 22 June 2005: Message edited by: Grant I R ]


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Alix
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posted 22 June 2005 09:50 AM      Profile for Alix     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
You think that attitude's over? I was told in my last job (by my female boss!) that I was making a good amount of money "for a second income."

I had been working there for almost a year at that point, and my boss, the person who told me this, knew perfectly well I was the *only* income.


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skdadl
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posted 22 June 2005 09:54 AM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
For the first ten or twelve years of my working life, I was automatically paid less than male colleagues doing the same work. The discrimination was open, and my bosses were shocked! shocked, I tell you! when anyone questioned the practice.
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Melsky
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posted 22 June 2005 10:06 AM      Profile for Melsky   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
There is a huge class-action lawsuit going on against Walmart in the US about how they discriminate against female employees. One of the reasons given by Walmart management for promoting less qualified men ahead of women is that women don't need the money to support their families the way men do.
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Hailey
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posted 22 June 2005 10:07 AM      Profile for Hailey     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Alix, how long ago was this?
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brebis noire
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posted 22 June 2005 10:21 AM      Profile for brebis noire     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
In my first job, I was implicitly told the same thing as Alix. My employer (also a woman) knew that mine was a "second income" - 'un revenu d'appoint' and paid me in consequence. I was unable to get a better-paying and better-located job, because those had already been taken by the male graduates of my class (most of the women, instead of getting a paid job in that field, went on to a Master's degree or an internship).
With my income at that time, I wouldn't have been able to decently support myself and my child, had I been single - especially considering all of the extra babysitting I would've needed, outside of regular daycare hours.

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Alix
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posted 22 June 2005 10:29 AM      Profile for Alix     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
It was two or three years ago.

I was surprised (and annoyed) to run into that. I kind of figured that by my generation (I'm 27), that had mostly gone away.

It didn't help that they kept being astonished that my husband did all the cooking and most of the housework.

Or that they assumed I wouldn't have ambition to get promoted, but when they hired a man a few months after they hired me, there was much angsting about whether or not he would want to move up and "become one of the suits". (We had virtually the same background - our B.A.s were even in the same area. And I'm the one who "moved up" by getting a better job, whereas he was a writer who only wanted a job at the level he had to pay the bills.)


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Bacchus
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posted 22 June 2005 10:49 AM      Profile for Bacchus     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Geez, these researchers have their heads in the sand.

That there was a glaring wage gap-no question
That the practice still goes on where unspoken or unchallenged-no question

That an idiot thinks its a good area of research as this study-what a maroon!

And who funded it? Equally idiots. Work no ways to end such things not spout statistics that reinforce inequalities

putzes all of them


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Bookish Agrarian
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posted 22 June 2005 10:53 AM      Profile for Bookish Agrarian   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Alix:
You think that attitude's over?

Did I say it was? No. Yet you assume I'm ignorant- so much of that lately Skdadl was talking about the past, and so I did too.

Of course women still face discrimination in the work force. It's arguably better than in my Mom's day, but resolved or put to bed. Not on your life. That's why feminism is so important and relevant today and unfortunetly will likley be for far too long a time to come.


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Alix
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posted 22 June 2005 10:55 AM      Profile for Alix     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I'm sorry Grant - I didn't really mean to sound like I was attacking you. That particular incident is still a hot-button one for me, as you can tell.
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Michelle
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posted 22 June 2005 11:17 AM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Grant I R:
Did I say it was? No. Yet you assume I'm ignorant- so much of that lately

Oh, I took Alix's question as a rhetorical one rather than aimed at you, Grant. It sounds like you know the score pretty well from your posts in this thread. I'm impressed with your wife's comeback to Mr. Master's Degree.


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skdadl
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posted 22 June 2005 11:30 AM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Och: as a bit of yippie political theatre, I think we should organize a movement to demand that every man who got a PhD while his wife was supporting him (often through secretarial work) should be required to split his degree with her.

All those senior guys with full professorships -- gone in one fell swoop.


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Bookish Agrarian
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posted 22 June 2005 11:35 AM      Profile for Bookish Agrarian   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Sorry Alix, it' been a very long few days. I'm probably even more crotchity than usual.
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Mr. Magoo
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posted 22 June 2005 11:39 AM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Uh, would it be too much to ask that in the spirit of equality, that law be ungendered?

I'm currently working two jobs while Mrs. Magoo pursues her PhD. And I cook.


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James
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posted 22 June 2005 11:40 AM      Profile for James        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
To acknowledge a small step forward, family law does now at least require the court to consider the degree to which one partner's efforts contributed to the other's education and income level/potential in awarding and setting spousal support after a breakup.
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skdadl
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posted 22 June 2005 11:41 AM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Oh, sure, Mr M: it can be non-gendered, and for the younger cohorts, that will probably produce some interesting and more equitable arrangements.

I was just thinking of clearing the logjam of my cohort out of the senior common rooms.


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saskatchewan
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posted 22 June 2005 11:55 AM      Profile for saskatchewan   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I think this is a completely valid research area. Many people consider this problem solved. Recent research is helpful to point out that we’re still in the middle of this.

When I moderated a forum for young mothers a number of years ago, so many of them were surprised and angry to discover that the division of household chores was still a contentious gender issue. (I was also unpleasantly shocked.)

Now I’m in the bizarre situation where I work for the same large corporation as my ex-husband. Except that he has seven years seniority over me, three full weeks of vacation, and makes nearly double my salary. Because I have custody – like most women, I had responsibility of the children before and after marriage – he also doesn’t have to worry about the kids getting sick and missing time off work.


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Raos
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posted 22 June 2005 12:31 PM      Profile for Raos     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I would be curious whether married working women who's husbands do most of the chores make more than single women.
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Albireo
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posted 22 June 2005 12:33 PM      Profile for Albireo     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
This study serves the interests of men so well that it almost reminds me of this "study".

~~~~~

Now, suppose that they did a survey like this among working women, and looked for salary differences among single women, married women who had somebody else (say, a husband or a maid) doing all of the housework for them and married women who had to do all of the housework. I'd be pretty shocked if that study didn't uncover the same kind of result: the fewer tedious commitments a person has outside of work, the more likely they are to succeed at work. Duhhh. Somebody please give me some grant money.

[Edited to add:]
Raos, I cross-posted with you while making the same point. Great minds and all...

[ 22 June 2005: Message edited by: Albireo ]


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audra trower williams
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posted 22 June 2005 12:42 PM      Profile for audra trower williams   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Michelle:

Oh, I took Alix's question as a rhetorical one rather than aimed at you, Grant. It sounds like you know the score pretty well from your posts in this thread. I'm impressed with your wife's comeback to Mr. Master's Degree.


Yeah, me too. Like when you say "Do you want to hear ANOTHER thing?" and don't really wait for the "Oh yes please I certainly would!"


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brebis noire
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posted 22 June 2005 12:46 PM      Profile for brebis noire     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I'll go scrounge up some of that grant money, Albireo, if you let me write the discussion of the results!

But I'd like how it is that initially when a man and a woman move in together or get married, household tasks are pretty much equally distributed according to their situation or their preferences, but that after the arrival of the first child, things become lopsided and the woman bears so much of the childcare and childraising responsibilities that there's little energy left for 'doing more' in the workplace.

As saskatchewan has alluded to, I think that guys who default on the emotional (the 'being there' of parenthood) and practical responsibilities of raising kids are missing out entirely on the whole point of having kids.


From: Quebec | Registered: Oct 2004  |  IP: Logged

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