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Topic: How can the children of the Holocaust do such things?
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remind
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6289
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posted 15 September 2007 08:14 AM
An incredibly powerful article by Sara Roy, thank you forposting it unionist. quote: For my mother and father Judaism meant bearing witness, raging against injustice and refusing silence. It meant compassion, tolerance, and rescue. In the absence of these imperatives, they taught me, we cease to be Jews. Many of the people, both Jewish and others, who write about Palestinians and Arabs fail to accept the fundamental humanity of the people they are writing about, a failing born of ignorance, fear and racism. Within the organized Jewish community especially, it has always been unacceptable to claim that Arabs, Palestinians especially, are like us, that they, too, possess an essential humanity and must be included within our moral boundaries, ...We speak without mercy, numb to the pain of others, incapable of being reached-unconscious. Our words are these:
The words she quotes are equivalent to those, supposedly expressed by the leader of Iran, yet they did not make the news like his did, why?
From: "watching the tide roll away" | Registered: Jun 2004
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HUAC
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 14425
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posted 23 September 2007 10:36 AM
quote: Originally posted by Ken Burch: Eloquent post, unionist. And HUAC if you disagree with unionist here,at least try to be coherent about it. I'm not sure why you seem to feel that what unionist is saying is undeserving of any respect on your part. [ 22 September 2007: Message edited by: Ken Burch ]
Unionists post consists entirely of a link to a left-wing gatekeeper site and a six month old essay, which I consider to be eloquently written. The essay, that is, not the link and most certainly not the post by unionist to the link, in which unionist didn't "say" anything at all. How in hell can anyone be accused of disagreeing with something that wasn't said, and, by extension, also be accused of disrespect for the particular individual who did't say it? The concept of "doublethink" could be applicable here, but only to a limited extent, as one facet of the requisite contradictory duality doesn't exist. I'm not sure of which one, however; it's a "chicken or egg" thing. I will admit and apologize for my response to unionist for my "went out and got loaded" remark, which could be seen as being in poor taste, although it was simply an attempt at humour. Given Mr. Mulcairs' well-deserved victory, a pint or two lifted in celebration (or anticipation) would certainly be understandable, IMO. That is why I made the remark and I am very sorry if it was misconstrued.
From: Ottawa | Registered: Aug 2007
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unionist
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11323
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posted 23 September 2007 10:44 AM
quote: Originally posted by HUAC: That is why I made the remark and I am very sorry if it was misconstrued.
Apology accepted. What I found less comprehensible was this remark: quote: They trot this tear-jerk bullshit out periodically, simply to pacify the hand-wringers for a day or two, while they re-arm and re-fuel. The slaughter of innocents will resume forthwith.
From: Vote QS! | Registered: Dec 2005
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unionist
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11323
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posted 03 October 2007 03:55 AM
"Why the Silence? by Rabbi Arthur Waskow quote: At the Great March for Jobs and Freedom in 1963, I heard Rabbi Joachim Prinz proclaim that silence is a crime. What is breeding silence now? The same old demons: Fear of the wealthy, deference to the powerful and a desire not to alienate "friends," merely to prevent thousands of deaths and maimings--so long as the dead are in someone else's family. Why should this decade be different from any other decade?When that Jewish antiwar ad appeared in the Times back in 2003, I called my daughter in Chicago to tell her it was there. She and my son, who had been children in the 1970s, had bravely walked in antiwar demonstrations then, and they had signed the new ad. In the midst of our conversation, I burst into unexpected tears. I told my daughter that I felt like apologizing to them for my generation's failure. I had thought that what we did in the late sixties and seventies had made another war like that one, like this coming one, impossible. Yet--here we were.
From: Vote QS! | Registered: Dec 2005
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jeff house
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 518
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posted 03 October 2007 06:04 AM
I generally like the concept behind "silence is a crime", as the Rabbi believes.At the very least, silence shows moral weakness and dishonesty. But it is important not to claim that "silence is a crime" about Israel, and not extend the same concept to other places where things fall far below decent standards of behaviour. If "silence is a crime" when it concerns Israel, but not when it concerns Hezbollah, for example, one is simply using a different, more severe standard of judgment for Israel. That's what discrimination is; to judge one group differently than another, without any articulable basis. So, yes, the "children of the Holocaust" should be forced to treat Palestinians fairly, as they do not now do. And....
From: toronto | Registered: May 2001
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jeff house
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 518
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posted 03 October 2007 07:21 AM
Presumably, you saw that I said that I like the CONCEPT that "silence is a crime" when there are clear ongoing vast violations of human rights.And presumably, you saw that the idea "silence is a crime" was recommended for use against "the children of the Holocaust", in other words, Jews. So, I certainly don't think people should be punished by the state just because they deny the holocaust or the crimes of Stalin. But I do think it speaks volumes about their ethics. Selective silence about the crimes of your side, whether it be Bush, the Communist Party, or the Burmese Junta, is always a moral crime. The US Constitution, and the Canadian Constitution too, refer to the right to silence when there is testimonial compulsion. That means that when you are placed under oath and questions are asked which have LEGAL consequences, one may invoke the right to silence. The right to silence has never been a moral principle which excuses lapses in intellectual honesty by those who apply a double standard to their friends and to their enemies. It's a legal principle which applies in legal proceedings.
From: toronto | Registered: May 2001
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Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790
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posted 03 October 2007 09:41 AM
I think that some Jewish people want to penetrate the overwhellming silence (especially from those in psotions of authority) among Jewish people about the criminal aspects of the Israeli regieme. They, unlike you, seem aware that you can tune into almost any mainstream media outlet in NA, and find Jewish people condemning Hezbollah.You seem to think that you are addressing an issue of balance. It is this very imbalance that they are addressing. When was the last time you caught Benjamin Netanyahu, carefully articulating a "balanced" perspective on the Lebanese crisis last year? When was the last time you raised this complaint by demanding that someone balance their condemnation of Hezbollah, by also critiquing Israel's treatment of Palestinians? Interestingly, it is only people who oppose Israeli Apartheid who you seem to think should speak with cotton in their mouths, issuing disclaimers, in each and every sentence.
From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003
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