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Author Topic: All about Dubai
Michelle
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posted 07 July 2008 06:04 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
An interesting interview about Dubai.

quote:
In a region bombarded by the chaos of the U.S.-driven "war on terror," Dubai, a small city-state located on the edge of Iran and Iraq, has become a city of glitz and glamour, a striking paradox that has enchanted many around the world.

Dubai's shining exterior is quickly becoming world famous, including a series of 300 constructed islands mapping out the shape of the world, an indoor ski mountain in the boiling temperatures of the Persian Gulf and the soon to be completed Burj Dubai, now the tallest man made structure in the world.

Behind Dubai's famous monuments are many contradictions, most strikingly the massive non-citizen work force that is estimated at close to 1 million people, labourers mainly from South Asia who work in conditions that multiple human rights organizations have condemned. In recent years the conditions facing these labourers have begun to gain attention internationally.

As a city-state, Dubai offers little possibility for democratic rights, as labour unions and political protest are outlawed and foreign workers are offered no possibility for citizenship. The entire political and economic system is tightly controlled by a ruling monarchy. Stefan Christoff of Tadamon! spoke with Mike Davis about the contemporary contradictions surrounding Dubai.



From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Doug
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posted 09 July 2008 09:10 AM      Profile for Doug   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
A British woman could be jailed for up to six years in Dubai after she was allegedly caught having sex on a beach.

The woman, said to be 30, was arrested after a police officer reportedly twice found her having sex with a British man on Jumeirah Beach.

She has reportedly been charged with having sex outside marriage, indecent behaviour in public, being drunk in public and assaulting a police officer.


No sex on the beach in Dubai!


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Frustrated Mess
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posted 09 July 2008 09:33 AM      Profile for Frustrated Mess   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
what was the male charged with?
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Ghislaine
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posted 09 July 2008 09:47 AM      Profile for Ghislaine     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Frustrated Mess:
what was the male charged with?

Under such a misogynist society, I would imagine nothing.


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Doug
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posted 09 July 2008 12:18 PM      Profile for Doug   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Frustrated Mess:
what was the male charged with?

"The holidaymaker accused in connection with her arrest faces a similar sentence."

They didn't exactly go out of their way to make it clear.


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Cueball
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posted 09 July 2008 12:30 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Ms Palmer is pretty clear that both are facing charges apparently, as she says:

quote:
Ms Palmer was quoted by the British tabloid newspaper The Sun as saying: “They’re going to make an example of us and we’re going to get a higher sentence. We are in so much trouble and my family and everybody are affected. Until someone is in this situation they could never know what it’s like. It’s bad – it’s so, so bad.”

In the same article the official version of the incident is described in detail:

quote:
The incident is said to have happened following a brunch last Friday at Le Meridien Hotel. Ms Palmer and the man – known only as “Vince” – met for the first time that day and had been drinking alcohol.

Ms Palmer, who moved to Dubai three years ago, later went with the man to the beach, where they were spotted kissing by a police officer and cautioned. Later, the same officer caught the couple having intercourse.

Friends said Ms Palmer, who lives in Jumeirah, allegedly shouted abuse at the officer and was arrested, taken to a police cell and charged. She has since been released on bail.


But of course, we are rich white westerners, and so can go anywhere, and act in accordance with our own views and morals, regaredless of what the local customs and law says... Right?


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Doug
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posted 09 July 2008 03:39 PM      Profile for Doug   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Oh, I still think what they did was tremendously rude and that they should have known in advance that it wasn't likely to end well - however, being sentenced for that long seems excessive.
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Cueball
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posted 09 July 2008 03:59 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Yeah, but getting busted for public fucking is hardly unexpected, even in Canada. I don't know what the sentence would be here, but the combined charges including assault police would certainly add up to a substantial sentence, not far off from these numbers.

In fact the sentencing maximum for the charge of assaulting an officer of the peace in Canada is almost double (five to ten years) that which is being proposed here. Notice the minimum sentence of five years is close to what Dubai provides as the their maximum sentence, so your quote in a Canadian context would look like:

quote:
A British woman could be jailed for up to ten years in Canada after she was allegedly caught having sex on a beach.

Minimum 3 months for assaulting a cop? Unheard of in this country, you are looking at 5 years, minimum sentence ...but oh those evil sexist Muslim moralists repressing basic human rights always gets good play among some cricles on this web site.

Why dat?

[ 09 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


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remind
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posted 09 July 2008 04:15 PM      Profile for remind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Agree with you cueball, however here they most likely would not be charged with having sex on a beach, and definitely not charged with having sex outside of marriage.

Just 2 weeks ago we caught a couple having sex at the regional park beach just up the road, all we did is walk away and decide to have apicnic elsewhere.


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Cueball
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posted 09 July 2008 04:20 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
You are not an cop. You are not obliged to intervene. The facts, which have yet to be disputed indicate that the officer in fact warned these people and then walked away, much like you did, but at the same time he paid lip service to his obligations and then bent the rules and let them go with a warning. The couple then continued with their activities.

I can imagine precisely the same from an officer in Canada, had people flagrantly disregarded a warning... but we are "drunk, white, western, horny and rich, so we can buy our way out of anything" and in fact.. guess what... they probably will.

But the headline is still there lingering in the public imagination, "woman might get six years for fucking" not "Woman charged with assault police in Dubai gets advantage of lienient sentencing guidlines".

[ 09 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


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Stargazer
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posted 09 July 2008 05:48 PM      Profile for Stargazer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
So, you trust the police in this situation? You think that because we live in the west we have zero right to condemn this way of treating people? If this was the deep south in the US, we'd be screaming bloody murder.

Sorry but I, for one, refuse to defend the actions of the state, or the police who carry out these repressive laws.


quote:
Behind Dubai's famous monuments are many contradictions, most strikingly the massive non-citizen work force that is estimated at close to 1 million people, labourers mainly from South Asia who work in conditions that multiple human rights organizations have condemned. In recent years the conditions facing these labourers have begun to gain attention internationally.

As a city-state, Dubai offers little possibility for democratic rights, as labour unions and political protest are outlawed and foreign workers are offered no possibility for citizenship. The entire political and economic system is tightly controlled by a ruling monarchy.


Flame away.


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Cueball
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posted 09 July 2008 06:04 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Of course not. That is not the issue. What is at issue here is the comparative standards of the law, and the apparent attempt to distort the public view of what is going on, as if this is merely a case of coitus on the beech, and excessive punishiment for breeches of the moral code (misdemeanors) when in fact there is a charge of a what is a serious criminal offence, fraudulent or otherwise.

The police here have certainly never been above making false claims either. Yet what we are being asked to believe is that something particularly unusual and "Islamic" is going on, when in fact throwing the book at obnoxious people is pretty much standard operating procedure all over the world.

In fact, it can be shown that if anything, Dubai, at least in terms of the observable legal code is less harsh in its application of the law in the case of charges of Assault Police. The cumulative weight of these charges would be greater in Canada, than they are in Dubai... where is the story? Why is it "interesting"? What prejudices does it play to? What is the "western" public reaction to this story, framed as it is? Why is it even on this thread?

You really think that people in France get to read full page headlines about incidents where couples get rousted by cops on Wassaga beech and the scenes turns ugly and some drunk persons ends up getting charged with Assaulting an Officer of the Peace with a possible five year sentence? That goes out on the wire on AP complete with little homilies about the opressive moral codes of Protestant puritanism, and mainstream newspapers worldwide pick it up?

Come on. The only thing that distinguishes this story from multiple similar events that happen almost daily in this country is that the people applying (or misapplying) the law are Muslim, and that is about it. Locally, this kind of story barely registers a blip on the media radar, when it happens right next door.

[ 10 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


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Cueball
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posted 09 July 2008 10:30 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:

According to sources, Palmer, who works in Dubai for magazines firm ITP Publishing, launched an angry four-letter tirade after her second romp was halted.

She is alleged to have called the cop a f****** Muslim **** and tried to hit him with her high-heeled shoe before being restrained.

As sex outside marriage is considered an offence in Dubai, Palmer was charged with it and with indecent behaviour in public, being drunk in public, and assaulting a police officer.


Brit woman in the dock for breaking 'no unmarried sex' law in Dubai

Racist comments coming from drunk white European? NO WAY! This allegation is notably missing from the Guardian article while other media, such as the Telegraph have recharachterized this as "Miss Palmer is said to have become aggressive," while the report I linked to above from "the National" is equally euphemistic about the reported details, where Plamer "allegedly shouted abuse at the officer and was arrested," and the alledged physical assault is not mentioned at all.

I'd say we are getting a pretty stilted version of the events here, where the headlines misrepresent the charges and make it appear that she will potentially serve six years for a moral misdermeanor, and key details of her alledged racist remarks, and assault are glossed over in "friendly" language, or ignored entirely, in a manner that draws focus toward the misdemeanor, and away from the more serious allegations.

Is this a good place to add that the two women apparently caught making out on the same beach in the spring, each got a month for the misdemeanor and were sent home?

[ 10 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


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Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 01:33 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well, Michelle, I have to say that is one of the more interesting articles I have seen on Babble. A very intriguing look at the conundrums of the new European "Cantons" in the Middle East, power, politics and war.

Now back to the important business of Muckraking Muslim tyranical Mores. Very interested to hear how this story all pans out, after all the hype. It turns out apparently that Ms. Palmer and her consort are not actually charged with anything, at this point, and are hoping they will get nothing...

quote:
It is understood that the pair's legal advisers have already lobbied the prosecutor not to continue - a perfectly normal legal manoeuvre in the emirate.

Mr Acors and Miss Palmer, who has since been sacked from ITP Publishing Group, spent much of yesterday in meetings with lawyers recommended to them from the British Embassy.

They have been told that they may have to wait up to three weeks until any court appearance. However, a source close to the pair revealed that they are 'quietly hopeful' that the charges will not reach court at all.


Revealed: The telecoms boss dubbed 'Vince Charming' at centre of Dubai 'sex on beach' case


"Che Guevara" of love, Vince Acor.

So, I guess eager Babblers will have to wait at least a few weeks before the sordid saga of our intrepid moral liberationists and their single handed battle to bring civilization to the sexist and repressive UAE begins to pan out. Speaking of our superior western moral fortitude and sense of justice, I am glad to see that her British employers ITP Publishing (incorporated in the British Virgin Islands) fired the wicked woman summarily, even though she has not been charged with nada!

For more information on our hero, just follow this link: Bonking Brit runs dodgy SMS company

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


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Frustrated Mess
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posted 12 July 2008 04:54 AM      Profile for Frustrated Mess   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Cueball, would it be too much to expect you to just accept your inherent Western superiority of culture, morals, and values without the sarcasm? It is getting so I don't remember who is to be bombed, who is to be showered with aplomb, and who is to be subject to a pogrom.

Now, in other news, while our George W. Bush is prancing around the world guilt and fear free, being the leader of the free world and having having rightly brought death and displacement to upwards of six per cent of the Iraqi population, the International Criminal Court is finally going after the president of Sudan.

I mean, if they think they can kill and ethnically cleanse their own populations, well ... next they'll think its their oil.

Oh, yes, I do recall. Bomb Iran, shower aplomb on Qatar and nuclear India (who said WMDs were always bad!), and a pogrom for land based indigenous peoples everywhere.


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Stargazer
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posted 12 July 2008 05:03 AM      Profile for Stargazer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
You're right Cueball, let's not even discus the outdated laws, their hatred of women (state sanctioned). Right. When you're a woman Cueball, then you can have some say about how "Western" women have no right to moralize the way women, gays and other people are treated. Until you grow some breasts and experience such horrid discrimination, I suggest you stay silent. Oh, that's right. You are staying silent!

After all, looks like in your world any enemy of the US is to be free from criticism.

And I deeply resent that YOU think you are the decision maker on what we can, and cannot address in terms of other countries.

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Stargazer ]


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M. Spector
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posted 12 July 2008 06:50 AM      Profile for M. Spector   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Stargazer:
After all, looks like in your world any enemy of the US is to be free from criticism.
Dubai, like the other United Arab Emirates, is not considered an enemy by the United States at present.
quote:
The UAE sent forces into Kuwait during the 1990–91 Gulf War.

The UAE supports military operations from the United States and other Coalition nations that are engaged in the invasions of Iraq (2003) and Afghanistan (2002) as well as Operations supporting the Global War on Terrorism for the Horn of Africa at the al-Dhafra Air Base located outside of Abu Dhabi. The al-Dhafra Air Base also supported American and Allied Operations during the 1991 Persian Gulf War and Operation Northern Watch.


- Wikipedia

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RevolutionPlease
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posted 12 July 2008 06:58 AM      Profile for RevolutionPlease     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I just thought Cueball was doing a fine job of deconstructing what the media did here. The media in this instance wasn't hoping to help women.
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remind
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posted 12 July 2008 06:58 AM      Profile for remind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
This is a confusing thread, or at least the posts are, for me, at least. Perhaps something has been lost in the editing of proceeding posts, to make the following posts appear to be offon a tangent.

Anyhow, the last link, cueball put up, states that Ms Palmer has a blog in which she wrote that the reports of her conduct are incorrect, but it gives no links to her blog, which is weird, and even weirder is they do give a link to a facebook group for the male.


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RevolutionPlease
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posted 12 July 2008 07:35 AM      Profile for RevolutionPlease     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by remind:
This is a confusing thread, or at least the posts are, for me, at least. Perhaps something has been lost in the editing of proceeding posts, to make the following posts appear to be offon a tangent.


That seems to be likely here, as I was confused too. Thanks remind.


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nonest factum
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posted 12 July 2008 08:30 AM      Profile for nonest factum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
Yeah, but getting busted for public fucking is hardly unexpected, even in Canada. I don't know what the sentence would be here, but the combined charges including assault police would certainly add up to a substantial sentence, not far off from these numbers.

In fact the sentencing maximum for the charge of assaulting an officer of the peace in Canada is almost double (five to ten years) that which is being proposed here. Notice the minimum sentence of five years is close to what Dubai provides as the their maximum sentence, so your quote in a Canadian context would look like:

Minimum 3 months for assaulting a cop? Unheard of in this country, you are looking at 5 years, minimum sentence ...but oh those evil sexist Muslim moralists repressing basic human rights always gets good play among some cricles on this web site.

Why dat?

[ 09 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]



Except for a little exaggeration here....in Canada there is description and the max sentences are almost never imposed in these tyoe of states (Dubai, Saudi etc) the laws are well shall we say barbaric. SO it's comparing apples to dinosaurs. Let's get intellectually honest here ok?

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500_Apples
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posted 12 July 2008 08:39 AM      Profile for 500_Apples   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The Che Guevara of love wtf.
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M. Spector
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posted 12 July 2008 01:48 PM      Profile for M. Spector   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
In fact the sentencing maximum for the charge of assaulting an officer of the peace in Canada is almost double (five to ten years) that which is being proposed here. Notice the minimum sentence of five years is close to what Dubai provides as the their maximum sentence...

Minimum 3 months for assaulting a cop? Unheard of in this country, you are looking at 5 years, minimum sentence ...


Section 270(2) of the Criminal Code of Canada provides for a maximum sentence of 5 years for assaulting a peace officer - same as Dubai. There is no minimum sentence.

Nobody ever gets that on a first offence; usually there is a fine. In any case, nobody would get anywhere near five years when the "assault" consists of verbal abuse and an attempt to hit the officer with a shoe.


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Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 02:16 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Yes, except for the fact that assault with a weapon, in this case a high heel shoe, moves the charge to the higher category, where the minimum sentence the Maximum is 10.

quote:
Assaulting a peace officer could also bring a maximum sentence of five years imprisonment. The charge of assaulting a peace officer includes an assault against someone who is helping a peace officer in official duties, or someone who is trying to make a lawful seizure of goods, such as a sheriff or bailiff. Resisting a lawful arrest or detention is considered to be assault of a peace officer as well.

An assault carried out with a weapon, or one that results in bodily harm, has a maximum sentence of ten years imprisonment.


Public Legal Education Association of Saskatchewan

But, I agree it is not likely that such a charge would stick, or amount to a huge sentence. But in fact I have witnessed cases where very simple assaults such as these, even when the weapon is relatively benign thing such as a shoe, get definied as assault with a weapon, in the charge sheet.

It's a common legal strategy, based on throwing the book at someone in order to ensure a conviction on something. Precisely what appears to be happening in Dubai in this case.

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 02:30 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by nonest factum:

Except for a little exaggeration here....in Canada there is description and the max sentences are almost never imposed in these tyoe of states (Dubai, Saudi etc) the laws are well shall we say barbaric. SO it's comparing apples to dinosaurs. Let's get intellectually honest here ok?

Really, the maximum sentence for are always imposed in "these types of states." What if I were to apply the same maxim and include Canada and the US in a phrase like "these types of states" and willy-nilly associate Canada with the "three strikes your out" law in the US or capital punishment for youths?

Is that the kind of barbarity you are talking about?

Regardless, if it is true that the UAE always applies the maximum sentence, then how is it that two women caught for fornincating on the very same beech in the "exceptionally" sexist and homophobic state of Dubai, merely got a month sentence before being deported?

You have presented nothing to prove your assertion that the UAE is particularly "barbaric" in comparison to Canada, and your view merely seems to be prejudiced. Perhaps you would like to further expand on the barbarity of the UAE, and show how it is particularly exceptional, in comparison to countries like the USA, Canadan and the UK?

Or are we supposed to accept your allegation of barbarity on faith?

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
nonest factum
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posted 12 July 2008 02:37 PM      Profile for nonest factum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:

Really, the maximum sentence for are always imposed in "these types of states."


[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


Oh so sorry. These types of states never ever ever have a history of human rights abuses....like say Samson, Arar, etc etc.

Get real please.


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Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 02:44 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I am asking you to demonstrate how this case is an example of "exceptional" barbarity, in comparison to the practices of Canadian law enforcement.

As I pointed out, the last two people, apparently lesbians (a woman from Bulgaria, and a woman from Lebanon) caught and charged with almost the same crime, without the Assault Police charge, were given a month sentence and then deported from Dubai. According to your vision of things they should have been hung up on hooks, garroted and then fed to the sharks.

They got a month for being lewd in public, and that is about it.

Your idea seems to be that Syria, the state of Saudi Arabia and the UAE are the same. They are no more "the same" that the USA and Canada and the UK are "the same." The Samson case happened in the exceptionally repressive Saudi Arabia, and the Arar case happened in Syria at the behest of the US with the co-operation of the Canadian government.

Direct responsibility for the barbarity of the treatement of Arar, pertains not only to Syria but to the USA and Canada, and your inclusion of it as an example, only demonstrates the essential point about hypocrisy I am trying to make. He was deported there with the foreknowledge that he would indeed by tortured, and indeed he was.

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
nonest factum
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posted 12 July 2008 02:59 PM      Profile for nonest factum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
He was deported there with the foreknowledge that he would indeed by tortured, and indeed he was.

Exactly because he COULD NOT be tortured in Canada according to Canadian law.
What part of "not according to Canadian law" don't you get?

From: left of the center | Registered: Mar 2008  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 03:00 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 

Basicly you are a racist hypocrite. I want to personally thank you for clearly demonstrating the kind of racist ignorance and double standards that the particular focus on this story, and the way it is cast in the media feed into.

Now please get back on topic and demonstrate what precisely is remarkable about this case, other than the fact that the action is transpiring in a Muslim country?

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
nonest factum
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posted 12 July 2008 03:07 PM      Profile for nonest factum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:

Basicly you are a racist hypocrite. Now please get back on topic and demonstrate what precisely is remarkable about this case, other than the fact that the action is transpiring in a Muslim country?

I also want to personally thank you for clearly demonstrating the kind of racist ignorance and double standards that the particular focus on this story, and the way it is cast in the media feed into.

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]



So I want to thank you for demonstrating that politically correctness taken to absurdity demonstrates intellectual dishonesty and idiocy.You're an ignorant idiot.So what.

From: left of the center | Registered: Mar 2008  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 03:08 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Demonstrate how the essential facts of this story are substantially different than something that could happen in this country. Something other than making general aspertions about the people of the middle east?

Can you at least do that?


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
nonest factum
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posted 12 July 2008 03:12 PM      Profile for nonest factum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Doug:

No sex on the beach in Dubai!



Would not even happen here. THAT'S the POINT.
(Must be the heat eh?)

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Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 03:17 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Here is a picture of the beach

Here is a picture of another beach, in Vancouver in a similar urban locale

You are saying that I can go down to this beach anytime I want to fuck and not get rousted by the cops?

It's you who needs to get real.


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nonest factum
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posted 12 July 2008 03:24 PM      Profile for nonest factum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
"A British woman could be jailed for up to six years in Dubai after she was allegedly caught having sex on a beach."

As you "well-know" (I am giving you the benefit of the doubt)here you'd get a slap on the wrist. Six years is reserved for killers.
OK you can stop "pretending" to be stupid now.


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Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 03:27 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
A british woman may get 6 years for cumulative charges stemming from an incident where she deliberately ignored a caution to cease her activity, and the woman, admitedly drunk then is alledged to have assaulted the police officer, and then was charged with a serious criminal charge which can get you 6 years in prison. The same charge in Canada, might get you 10.

In Dubai, the last case of "sex on the beech" got two women exactly a one month sentence, each.

I take it you have never been arrested in Canada, and that you don't know anyone who has been arrested on the Assault Police charge here. I am right?

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


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nonest factum
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posted 12 July 2008 03:34 PM      Profile for nonest factum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
A british woman may get 6 years for cumulative charges stemming from an incident where she deliberately ignored a caution to cease her activity, and the woman, admitedly drunk then is alledged to have assaulted the police officer, and then was charged with a serious criminal charge which can get you 6 years in prison. The same charge in Canada, might get you 10.

In Dubai, the last case of "sex on the beech" got two women exactly a one month sentence.

I take it you have never been arrested in Canada, and that you don't know anyone who has been arrested on the Assault Police charge here. I am right?

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


Yes you're absolutely right. I am profoundly sorry and beg your humble forgiveness. You obviuosly have superior experience and wisdom.
I'm wrong you're right. Is that better now?


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Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 03:36 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
No. I would like you to continue demonstrating the prejudice that this kind of media muckraking is intented to foster and feed into. But, I guess, even you must be running out of ridiculous arguements, since you would really have to launch into some wacko stuff to say anything at this point.
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nonest factum
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posted 12 July 2008 04:13 PM      Profile for nonest factum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
since you would really have to launch into some wacko stuff to say anything at this point.

I'll leave that to you. You seem to do a good job of it here.

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Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 04:20 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
You have shown absolutely nothing to prove that in this particular case there is anything exceptional about this incident, other than the fact that it is taking place in a Muslim country.

Please identify what is exceptional about it?

Or are you still clinging to the idea that if I went down to Cherry Beach to fuck, and the cops discovered me doing that they would not intercede?

Or are you now saying that if they let me off with a warning, and then came back and discovered that I had ignored their warning, that they would just say... "ok well, I don't care if you flagrantly disrespect my authority, or my generosity of having let you off the first time," and then walk away?

ROFL!

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
nonest factum
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posted 12 July 2008 04:32 PM      Profile for nonest factum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The same standard in Canada I'm sure:

quote:
Iran: Death Penalty for Blogging?


On Wednesday, Iranian members of parliament voted to discuss a draft bill that seeks to “toughen punishment for disturbing mental security in society.” The text of the bill would add, “establishing websites and weblogs promoting corruption, prostitution and apostasy,” to the list of crimes punishable by death.

In recent years, some Iranian bloggers have been sent to jail and many have had their sites filtered. If the Iranian parliament approves this draft bill, bloggers fear they could be legally executed as criminals. No one has defined what it means to “disturb mental security in society”.

Such discussion concerning blogs has not been unique to Iran. It shows that many authorities do not only wish to filter blogs, but also to eliminate bloggers!

A state policy to control blogs

About a year and a half ago, the Iranian government demanded that bloggers should register and provide their names and addresses on a site called Samandehi. Many people believed such a process would facilitate legal action against them.

Bloggers resisted and many published an “I do not register my blog/site” banner on their blogs. The Government then realised it cannot have real control of the situation, or force bloggers to register.

In the footsteps of Yemen?

Unfortunately, the Iranian case is not unique to the Middle East and to the world. In April, MidEastYouth talked about new repressive measures adopted by Yemen, quoting Walid Al-Saqaf, YemenPortal.net's administrator:

“This week, the government’s Minister of Information threatened to file lawsuits against news websites on the justification of ‘inciting hatred’ or ‘harming national interests’ and the other usual excuse they often use to prosecute journalists. The threat is even more severe for websites because the government would use the penal code instead of the press law. This means that website owners could receive even death penalties.”

“Don’t be upset, we'll execute you legally”

Nikahang, a leading Iranian online cartoonist and blogger, says [Fa]:

if this draft bill becomes law, everything will be based on interpretation and a simple blogger will be considered a center to destroy people’s religion! What can I say? Only people who disturb people’s mental security could support such a thing.


The rest here


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laine lowe
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posted 12 July 2008 04:42 PM      Profile for laine lowe     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Five years is a pretty stiff sentence for public sex between two men!

As for Ms. Palmer's assault/abuse of the police officer, she should count herself lucky that they didn't use taser guns.

The media coverage certainly seemed framed in an "us" (liberated, civil, reasonable) and "them" (misogynist, uncivilized, barbaric) context. I have friends living in the UAE (both indigenous and ex-pats) and I have never heard them complain about their lives being threatened by archaic laws.

If anything, their human rights violations are mostly in the realm of mistreating migrant workers and being very much anti-union. Everyone making money in Dubai is living quite well, including ex-pats who choose to follow local customs and laws. I believe there are even ways around the alcohol prohibition.

There have never been any reports of torture or excessive use of force filed by human rights watch groups.


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Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 05:18 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by laine lowe:
Five years is a pretty stiff sentence for public sex between two men!

If anything, their human rights violations are mostly in the realm of mistreating migrant workers and being very much anti-union. Everyone making money in Dubai is living quite well, including ex-pats who choose to follow local customs and laws. I believe there are even ways around the alcohol prohibition.


I am glad someone is willing to discuss some serious politics, rather than this hyped up fluff case. Yes, the real question here is; would the same lenient standards of law enforcement that are metted out to westerners be applied universally to anyone living in Dubai, or is it just that the UAE makes every effort to simulate "western standards" in the case of rich powerful white westerners, in order to avoid embarassing scenes involving European expats?

Noest factum: Please explain how the repression of civil liberties in Iran has anything to do with politics in the UAE, and moreso how this bears on proving how the specific case in question involving "sex on the beach" can be shown to be exceptional to the standard of law enforcement in Canada? BTW, "Youtube" is banned in Turkey because it has been used to say negative things about Kemal Attaturk, and his "secular" vision of the Turkish state.

In anycase, I am glad you are back on track with your prejudiced tirades, and wacko red herring hunt. Any comment on the 5 year sentence for talking about sodomy in the USA?

quote:
“It’s pretty harsh to sentence someone to five years in jail for speech, when actual public fornication receives only 12 months.”

Wow! And this is Virginia. A possible 12 month sentence for public fornication! The one and only case ever brought to trial in Dubai of a same-sex couple getting busted for actual public fornication, only resulted in a 1 month sentence, before deportation.

Ok, I admit that is a little bit off topic. My real question is; where is the outrage at Ms. Palmer being summarily fired from her job by her British employer, even though she has not actually even been charged, yet? Anyone care to gloss that over?

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
nonest factum
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posted 12 July 2008 05:55 PM      Profile for nonest factum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Noest factum: Please explain how the repression of civil liberties in Iran has anything to do with politics in the UAE, and moreso how this bears on proving how the specific case in question involving "sex on the beach" can be shown to be exceptional to the standard of law enforcement in Canada?
In anycase, I am glad you are back on track with your prejudiced tirades, and wacko red herring hunt.

Funny how blinded and intellectually dishonesty from political correctness is somehow not prejudiced ...but calling a spade a fucking shovel is...hmmm

This is your lovely free and strong Dumai:

quote:
No Male Rape Crime in the UAE?
by Greta Van Susteren

As you know, we were in UAE last week..so naturally this article caught my attention. The allegation is assault of a MALE teen (see the text in blue below)…read it and post your comment:

2 Men Accused of Kidnapping, Sexually Assaulting French Teen in United Arab Emirates

Thursday , November 01, 2007

DUBAI, United Arab Emirates —

Two Emirati men are accused of sexually assaulting a 15-year-old French teen, a case that has raised questions about the protection of foreigners and the fairness of a legal system where male rape does not exist as a crime.
The defendants — aged 35 and 18 — briefly appeared in court Wednesday where one was appointed a new lawyer. The other defendant’s attorney did not appear in court for the hearing, which lasted a few minutes.

The two are accused of kidnapping two French teens and sexually assaulting one of them in July. A third defendant, also accused of taking part in the assault and also Emirati, is being tried in a juvenile court where the proceedings are closed to the public.

Last week, the two adult defendants pleaded not guilty to charges of kidnapping with deceit and illicit sexual intercourse.

According to court documents, the 35-year-old defendant has been identified as HIV positive.

The charges against the two adult defendants carry the death penalty if convicted. It was not immediately clear what sentence the third defendant would face if convicted in juvenile court.

The Emirates’ legal system prohibits the media from naming the defendants until a verdict is reached in the case.

The case has garnered much attention and controversy here in this booming Gulf tourist hub, which boasts of its prosperous economy, relatively moderate lifestyles, and fair commercial and criminal legal systems.

Some expatriates here have long complained that foreigners have few legal rights. Emirati citizens are far outnumbered by foreign workers and expatriates, mostly from Asia but also from Europe.

Dubai officials deny they have mishandled the case and say they treat fairly both Emiratis and foreigners living in Dubai.

Dubai remains largely hostile to homosexuality. The UAE legal system does not recognize rape of men as a crime, only rape of women, although prosecutors can bring other charges in the case of a sexual assault against a man, as they have in the French teenager’s case.

The teenager and his family have told French newspapers and Web sites that Dubai authorities tried to discourage them from pressing charges in the case, and also failed to tell them that one defendant had tested HIV positive.

The French newspaper Liberation quoted the victim’s family as saying police also tried to force the teen to say he was a homosexual, immediately after the attack. He now lives in Switzerland.

The family could not be reached by The Associated Press this week and calls to the teen’s lawyer in Dubai were not returned.

According to court documents, the juvenile defendant offered the two French teens, one of whom he knew slightly, a ride home from a Dubai mall. The two French teens got in the car but were later joined by the other two adult defendants, the documents said.

The group drove to the edge of the Dubai desert, where the three defendants are accused of taking turns sexually assaulting one of the teens in the car while the other one was told to stay behind a sand dune, according to the court documents.

The judge on Wednesday set another hearing for Nov. 7.



Civil liberties in Dubai


From: left of the center | Registered: Mar 2008  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 05:59 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
What is your problem they bust people for kidnapping and sexual assault against teens in Dubai? Outrageous!

Or perhaps you are suggesting that gay people get railroaded by the unfair application of the law in Dubai, unlike Viginia where even talking about public same-sex fornication with an adult can net you five years, in a country where teens themselves are routinely executed for capital crimes.

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


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laine lowe
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posted 12 July 2008 06:03 PM      Profile for laine lowe     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Isn't Greta Van Susteren that legal talking head from FOX and close friend of former US Attorney General Ashcroft? Hard to take her outrage or framing seriously.
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nonest factum
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posted 12 July 2008 06:06 PM      Profile for nonest factum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
It's a mad hatter's tea party!

Dubai is a free and open state and USA is a fascist, imperialist, racist, (of course Zionist) repressive , and totalitarian state. Excuse me!Sorry for not getting you're "logic."

You're killing me!

I think I'd rather chew tin foil than "debate" you.


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Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 06:10 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
No. It is the USA that executes teenagers, not I you.

quote:
Twenty-one* U.S. states allow for the execution of people who were 16 or 17 at the time of the crime. Out of the 38 death penalty states, 16 have abolished this punishment for juvenile offenders.

In the past five years, the United States has executed 13 juvenile offenders. Eight of these executions took place in the state of Texas. The rest of the world combined carried out five such executions. The United States accounts for four of the last five known juvenile offender executions in the last two years.


Amnesty International

So aside from prejudice do you have anything to add to this thread, in the way of facts?

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Fidel
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posted 12 July 2008 07:01 PM      Profile for Fidel     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
And they execute mentally handicapped people, too.
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nonest factum
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posted 12 July 2008 07:10 PM      Profile for nonest factum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
forget about it.....

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: nonest factum ]


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Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 07:44 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Again, the issue is not wether or not the USA is fascist, and Dubai is not. That is your farcical ideological fixation, not mine.

I have made no such assertion, the assertion I have made is that in this particular case there is nothing extraordinary in comparison to how the case might evolve or be handled in comparison to Canada. Given that you can not actually show that there is any substantial difference, and in fact similar charges of assault police resulting from occassions where drunk people willfully disregard police warnings to cease and disist, happen on a regular basis in this country, with the result that the persons in question may face substantive jail terms for the resultant felony.

In fact, the only thing thing that is exceptional is the fact that it is happening in a Muslim country, and if this had happened in Canada, or the US or Britain, the case would not have made the local news, or if it did it would be a 100 word "human interest" piece, found on page 43.


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
nonest factum
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posted 12 July 2008 08:01 PM      Profile for nonest factum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The ugly truth about Dubai

No different than Canada or Australia?


Speaking of Canada


Rape victims subject to threats and abuse in Dubai

Human rights in Dubai....?
In your dreams!


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Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 08:28 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
You really have trouble with English comprehension: "the assertion I have made is that in this particular case there is nothing extraordinary in comparison to how the case might evolve or be handled in comparison to Canada."

Thanks for the link about the implimentation of USA style "Zero-Tolerance" drug laws by Dubai customs officials. Very interesting to see that they are implimenting the controversial US policy. Here is some more information on that:

quote:
The policy did not involve enacting new laws or regulations; it only entailed instituting strict interpretation and enforcement of existing laws. In practice, it meant that any type of vehicle—including bicycles, transfer trucks, and yachts—would be confiscated and the passengers arrested upon the discovery of any measurable amount of illicit drugs. The U.S. Coast Guard and the U.S. Customs Service began to crack down on all cases of drug possession on the water and at all borders. If, during the course of their regular patrols and inspections, Coast Guard personnel boarded a vessel and found one marijuana cigarette, or even the remnants of a marijuana cigarette, they arrested the individual and seized the boat. Before this policy was instituted, the Coast Guard had either looked the other way or issued fines when "personal-use" quantities of illicit substances were discovered (United States Congress, 1988).

These policies have also been extended throughout the country, including in schools.

Zero Tolerance

I am curious, why specifically are you interested in this type of thing when it pertains to Muslim countries, but not the USA?

Are you seriously going to ask me to engage the topic raised by a "youtube" blogger called "Victor Crusader"? It's a serious issue of course, but if you want people to treat it seriously, you had better find another source, other than "Victor Crusader."

[ 12 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
nonest factum
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posted 12 July 2008 08:48 PM      Profile for nonest factum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Nice try but I don't really care about your "curiosity".

And you, sir have trouble comprehending...facts...which might get in the way of your prejudices or preoccupations.

So goodbye.


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Cueball
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posted 12 July 2008 08:51 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
So, what about "Zero tolerance" in USA customs drug enforcement? Or is it only "fascist" when Arabs do it? Doesn't fit the world view you so desperately want to believe, so you will just ignore it.

quote:
The United States has zero tolerance for possession and smuggling of illicit drugs. Travellers caught with even a small amount will end up in jail.

Ministry of Foreign Affairs and International Trade Canada -- Web Site

Your off? Cherrio! Pleasant dreams. Perhaps one of these days you will wake up.

[ 13 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 15 July 2008 05:31 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Sex-on-the-beach Briton's grovelling apology to Dubai

quote:
In a letter addressed to the people of Dubai, Vince Acors said he was "humbled and humiliated" by his actions and claimed he felt "honest and abject remorse".

Although he concedes that he was very drunk and acted offensively, he denied the most serious accusation of having penetrative sex with a woman he is not married to.

[SNIP]

Miss Palmer and Mr Acors are unlikely to contest the drunk in public charge as blood tests have revealed that Mr Acors had 149 mg alcohol per 100 ml of his blood and Miss Palmer had 127 mg of alcohol per 100 ml of blood.

Both blood alcohol readings are more than the British drink-drive limit of 80 milligrammes of alcohol per 100 millilitres of blood. They clearly breach Dubai's ban having any alcohol in public places.


Britons party on in Dubai despite arrest of woman for alleged sex on the beach

quote:
"I'm sorry, but if someone does something like that they're a silly moo," said Stuart Frost, 42, a legal executive sunbathing on the strip of public beach where Ms Palmer was arrested. "If you have been here for three years, you should know how to behave. And if you assault a police officer in any country you are in trouble, not just here."


[ 15 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 22 July 2008 11:26 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 

[ 23 July 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 23 July 2008 12:08 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Not to be outdone, the repressive Orthdox Christian regieme of Greece is mad about fucking Brits on the beech: Britons arrested in Greek sex competition

quote:
ATHENS (Reuters) - Nine British women were facing prostitution charges after being arrested at the weekend for taking part in an oral sex competition in the Greek holiday island of Zakynthos, police said on Monday.


Also a little behind the times but here it is:

'Sex-crazy Brits must go'

quote:
"Unfortunately, young Britons have been shown in photographs engaging in acts that are not only low-life but, frankly, criminal," said Varvarigos, a veteran socialist deputy in the Greek parliament.

"We're talking about a lot of people. As many as possible should be located, extradited (back to Greece for trial) if need be, and made to bear the consequences," he said.

"Under Greek law that might mean enduring prison sentences of two or three years, but it would set an example."


And this other blast from the past... Club 18-30 reps charged in Greece

quote:
FIVE HOLIDAY reps filmed in an alleged oral sex competition on a Corfu beach face prison sentences of up to two years after being charged with debauchery by the Greek authorities.

[Snip]

Last week Gemma Gunning, 18, from Bath, was jailed for eight months for dancing topless in a bar in Faliraki on the Greek island of Rhodes.


Outrage please...


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Catchfire
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posted 23 July 2008 03:33 AM      Profile for Catchfire   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Wonderful job, Cueball, at pointing out the hypocrisy of this news story and the sensationalist Islamophobia that drives public reaction.

I thought of this story that made the rounds in Canadian media a few years back, where a Parisian couple could have faced a year in Jail for fucking in the Vimy Ridge memorial in France. Here's how Canwest characterized the act:

quote:
Vimy Ridge memorial defiled by kinky sex acts, courts told

A world-famous Canadian war memorial that even Adolf Hitler treated with respect is being desecrated by kinky local adventurers posing for photographs and videos that are later being posted on porn websites.



What prudes we are! Objecting to acts of public sex that offend the social and cultural values on which we found our national identity! Following the outrage of Western media etc. in the OP, we should decry French laws as barbaric, and the Canadian response, which was unanimous and furious, as puritan.

But for some reason we tend to hold our cultural values in higher esteem than those with brown skin.


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Cueball
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posted 09 August 2008 11:23 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
“I think that the authorities will simply decide to make an example out of her,” he said. She will be prosecuted by a Muslim Public Prosecutor, and thereafter tried and sentenced by a Muslim court, who will apply UAE laws, which are quite strict. This is particularly when the case involves an assault on public officers and an offence to Islam, which is the state religion and the main source of legislation according to the UAE constitution.

“I believe that westerners, and mostly tourists, see the glittering image of Dubai in the media and tend to forget that after all, this is a Muslim country,” he added. It maybe more tolerant than other Muslim countries, but is still attached to a set of moral conservative standards coded in its laws.

“People have to understand that the act of kissing in Public considered normal by today's European standards is considered as a criminal offence according to UAE laws and customs. Of course the authorities in Dubai tend to be more tolerant than the other emirates in the interpretation and application of the laws but these laws are still in place and they can act upon them whenever the lines are crossed.”


Brits Accused of Bringing ‘Social Depravity’ to Dubai


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 04 September 2008 03:37 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Might as well update this classic of Babble embarassments:

Britons' 'sex on the beach' trial adjourned

The scurilous muckraking continues in the MSM. Now that it has been firmly entrenched in the mind of the public that Palmer is being tried principally on the charge of "sex before marriage", the fact that she is charged with assaulting a cop doesn't even warrant mentioning:

quote:
DUBAI (AFP) - A judge in Dubai on Tuesday adjourned for a week the trial of two Britons accused of having sex on a beach in the conservative Gulf state, a court official said.

The piece goes on to highlight the backwardness of this "conservative Gulf state" has convicted westerners of indecency charges before:

quote:
Nearly 85 percent of the UAE's population, estimated at over 5.6 million at the end of 2006, are foreigners, but the native Muslim population remains generally conservative.

In August, two foreign women were jailed for a month after they were convicted of fondling each other and engaging in "indecent acts" on a Dubai beach.


I guess it was not worth mentioning that this Jordanian woman, and her Bulgarian friend served less than a month for public grinding on the beach, and were then deported.


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
M. Spector
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 8273

posted 04 September 2008 04:12 PM      Profile for M. Spector   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
Might as well update this classic of Babble embarassments:
Yes, it certainly is a babble embarrassment, but not for the reasons you think. It's embarrassing to see you going out of your way to defend this Puritanical nonsense.
quote:
The scurilous muckraking continues in the MSM. Now that it has been firmly entrenched in the mind of the public that Palmer is being tried principally on the charge of "sex before marriage", the fact that she is charged with assaulting a cop doesn't even warrant mentioning:
Throwing a Jimmy Choo shoe at a cop is a serious offence?

Never mind the MSM; it's apparently not even worth mentioning in this story from the Emirates Xpress, which says:

quote:
Michelle Palmer and Vincent Acors were arrested on July 5 and charged with committing consensual sex, public indecency and illegally consuming alcohol.

How do you even know the phony "assault" charge is still pending?
quote:
I guess it was not worth mentioning that this Jordanian woman, and her Bulgarian friend served less than a month for public grinding on the beach, and were then deported.
Oh yeah. They got off with a slap on the wrist.

From: One millihelen: The amount of beauty required to launch one ship. | Registered: Feb 2005  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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Babbler # 4790

posted 04 September 2008 04:20 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
How do you know anything Spector? No one ever assaults cops? Lol. Regardless, the point is that a phoney assault charge would hold the same weight here as there, and this is a non-story.

People get put away for years in this country for public "indecency", and it never even makes the news. But yeah... lets talk about Dubai.


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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Babbler # 4790

posted 04 September 2008 04:26 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Why Dubai? Why not the state of Georgia?

Is it illegal to sunbathe nude in your own backyard in the State of Georgia?

O.C.G.A. § 16-6-8. Public indecency.
Jump to Comments

quote:

(a) A person commits the offense of public indecency when he or she performs any of the following acts in a public place:

(1) An act of sexual intercourse;

(2) A lewd exposure of the sexual organs;

(3) A lewd appearance in a state of partial or complete nudity; or

(4) A lewd caress or indecent fondling of the body of another person.


(b) A person convicted of the offense of public indecency as provided in subsection (a) of this Code section shall be punished as for a misdemeanor except as provided in subsection (c) of this Code section.

(c) Upon a third or subsequent conviction for public indecency for the violation of paragraph (2), (3), or (4) of subsection (a) of this Code section, a person shall be guilty of a felony and shall be punished by imprisonment for not less than one nor more than five years.

(d) For the purposes of this Code section only, “public place” shall include jails and penal and correctional institutions of the state and its political subdivisions.

(e) This Code section shall be cumulative to and shall not prohibit the enactment of any other general and local laws, rules, and regulations of state and local authorities or agencies and local ordinances prohibiting such activities which are more restrictive than this Code section.


Answer? Depends on the definition of 'Public Place'

[ 04 September 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790

posted 18 October 2008 11:27 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
And the answer is 3 months and then deported.

'Sex on Dubai beach' couple Michelle Palmer and Vince Acors jailed

quote:
A British couple have received three month jail sentences for having sex on a beach in Dubai.

Michelle Palmer, 36, and Vince Acors, 34, were found guilty of having sexual intercourse outside marriage and offending public decency. They were also fined £200 for drunkenness and ordered to be deported from Dubai on their release.

It had been feared that the two Britons might face several years in jail in the United Arab Emirates (UAE).


Not as feared. The couple recieved sentences well within the norms of most western societies, and even less harsh than some examples of similar cases in wetern countries.

A man in virgina was given 12 months for suggesting public sex, while Gemma Gunning was jailed for eight months for dancing topless in a bar in Greece.

But those evile repressive muslims... doncha know.


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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Babbler # 4790

posted 19 October 2008 12:03 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
comments?
From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790

posted 21 October 2008 11:16 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 

From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790

posted 24 October 2008 01:01 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Man caught having sex with table gets 6 months

quote:
Police say that during questioning, Price admitted he had sex with the picnic table. He also confirmed the incidents caught on the DVD and admitted to having sex with the table inside his home.

From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
remind
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6289

posted 24 October 2008 01:44 AM      Profile for remind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Police say the the incidents occurred close to Ridge Elementary School.

On June 18, 2008, Price pleaded 'no contest' to disseminating harmful material to juveniles and public indecency.



From: "watching the tide roll away" | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790

posted 24 October 2008 10:47 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I suspected that was not going to get by you. Regardless, not really clear what is being said here, masturbating in your own home "near" an elementary school? "Dissemintating"? Hmmm. hard to say what is going on based on the article.

But its news of the "weird", like the Palmer story, so it fits generally with the thread.


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
remind
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6289

posted 24 October 2008 10:52 AM      Profile for remind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Cue, we actually had a whole thread on it here a while back, it must have been when you having a break. So I was very familar with the picnic table story and could have just linked you to the thread that was here about but was lazy.

Anyhow he was masturbating with the table on his outside patio which overlooked the school play ground.


From: "watching the tide roll away" | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790

posted 24 October 2008 10:52 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Really? Someone started a thread for that? How tiresome.

Boulder chief defends cops' handling of public nudity

quote:
The 55-year-old Boulder man wound up in a jail cell for allegedly running naked along Folsom Street — something police say he’s apparently done several times this month.

Orloff faces a misdemeanor charge of indecent exposure, which could land him jail time or stiff fines. He also could have to register as a sex offender.


[ 24 October 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
remind
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6289

posted 24 October 2008 11:02 AM      Profile for remind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Yep... oh here it is, it never really went anywhere either though.

http://www.rabble.ca/babble/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=13&t=003779&p=


From: "watching the tide roll away" | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790

posted 24 October 2008 11:36 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Turns out that the original assertion that Acors and Palmer might have faced "six years in prison" for "sex on the beach" may also be dubious, as per this article published by a Kuwaiti newspaper.

quote:
Michelle Palmer and Vince Acors - both in their 30s - face up to two years in prison if convicted of sex outside marriage, public indecency and drunkenness. A judge is expected to issue a verdict in the case today - a decision that risks alienating Dubai's tourists or further upsetting Emiratis angry at the government's willingness to relax moral standards in the name of growth.

Beach sex trial exposes Dubai's cultural divide

[ 24 October 2008: Message edited by: Cueball ]


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