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Author Topic: execution of 16-year-old girl in Iran
Debra
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posted 25 August 2004 10:34 AM      Profile for Debra   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=97
quote:
Ateqeh Sahaleh was hanged in public on Simetry Street and Rah Ahan Street at the city center after a sham trial, in which she was accused of committing “acts incompatible with chastity.” The teenage victim had no access to a lawyer at any stage and efforts by her family to retain one were to no avail. Ateqeh personally defended herself. She told the religious judge, Haji Rezaii, that he should punish those who force women into adultery, not the victims. The judge used harsh words to scold her for the way she had dressed.

Ateqeh's national ID card stated that she was 16 years old. The judiciary, however, claimed falsely that she was 22.

The sentence was issued by the head of Neka’s Justice Department. The judiciary chief in Mazandaran sent the case to the Supreme Court, were it was subsequently upheld with the approval of Judiciary Chief Mahmoud Hashemi Shahroudi.

Rezaii, the religious judge who issued the original sentence, personally pursued Ateqeh’s death sentence, beyond all normal procedures. He personally put the noose around her neck as she was taken to the gallows. After Ateqeh was hanged, Rezai said her offense did not call for execution, but that he had her executed for her “sharp tongue”.


More at amnesty:

http://web.amnesty.org/library/index/engmde130362004


From: The only difference between graffiti & philosophy is the word fuck... | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
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posted 25 August 2004 10:41 AM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Jesus Christ. That makes me so angry.

A perfect example of why religion and religious leaders have no place in the judicial system.


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skdadl
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posted 25 August 2004 10:41 AM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
This is sickening. Women have been dying for their "sharp tongues" through the ages everywhere, of course, but we have to find effective ways to protest the frenzied neo-cons in Iran.

Notice Amnesty's preferred way of working: while they publicize these outrages world-wide, they continue to address the government of Iran directly, appealing to Iran to live up to its international obligations (which it has here violated). They don't appear to be calling for sanctions from anyone else.


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beverly
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posted 25 August 2004 01:35 PM      Profile for beverly     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 

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Briguy
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posted 25 August 2004 01:43 PM      Profile for Briguy     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Ditto on the . Things like this make me want to call for a regime change, despite knowing better.

Edited to clarify: I know better than to expect good things from an external regime change. I will be overjoyed when the internal regime change becomes a reality.

[ 25 August 2004: Message edited by: Briguy ]


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Fidel
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posted 25 August 2004 04:16 PM      Profile for Fidel     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:

Notice Amnesty's preferred way of working: while they publicize these outrages world-wide, they continue to address the government of Iran directly, appealing to Iran to live up to its international obligations (which it has here violated). They don't appear to be calling for sanctions from anyone else.[/QB]

I've noticed the same thing. I was giving to them for a membership, and they sent me all these post cards for my signature to send to various leaders and despots in protest of human rights violations. And the targets for dissent all seemed to line up with who was on Uncle Sam's sh!t list. I could've done a better job of making a blacklist of despots and checking it twice myself.


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Vansterdam Kid
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posted 25 August 2004 07:09 PM      Profile for Vansterdam Kid   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Is it me or is this regieme (Iran) getting more opressive. It seems like after their parliamentary 'elections' where the reformists where prevented from running again their nut-jobs are getting even more reactionary.
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Hailey
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posted 27 August 2004 01:14 AM      Profile for Hailey     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I understood that the issues were beyond having a sharp tongue and encompassed a concern that she had not been sufficiently chaste. I understand that in an earlier hearing she disrobed and hurled insults at the Judge.

I can't find a url to verify this regretfully and I don't know if anyone can confirm this.

It still wouldn't make it the right decision.


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beluga2
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posted 27 August 2004 01:25 AM      Profile for beluga2     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
He personally put the noose around her neck as she was taken to the gallows.

I'm usually firmly opposed to the death penalty, but if and when there is a 2nd Iranian Revolution (bring it on!), I wouldn't shed a tear if someone decided to subject this judge to a bit of his own medicine. Fucker.

A couple more depressing points from the Amnesty article:

- This is the 10th execution of a child since 1990.
- The male "co-accused" was sentenced to 100 lashes, then released.


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Debra
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posted 27 August 2004 09:32 AM      Profile for Debra   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well here you go Hailey, I guess this proves she deserved to be hung.

Ya know there is little conspiracy theorist in me who believes it was the sick and twisted judge who stole her body.

quote:
Translation From Persian: By Khorshid ActivistChat Member
On Sunday August 15, 2004, a 16 year old girl by the name of Atefe Rajabi, daughter of Ghassem Rajabi, was executed in the town of Neka, located in the province of Mazandaran, for “engaging in acts incompatible with chastity”. The execution was carried out by the order of Neka’s “judicial administrator” and was approved by both the Supreme Court of the Islamic Republic and the chief of the nation’s “judiciary branch.”

Although according to her birth certificate she was only 16 years old, the local court falsely claimed that she was 22.

Three months ago, during her appearance before the local court, fiercely angry the young girl hurled insults at the local judge, Haji Reza, who is also the chief judicial administrator of the city, and it is said as another expression of protest took off some of her clothes in the courtroom. This act by the young girl made the administrator so furious that he evaluated her file personally and in less than three months received a go-ahead from the Islamic Republic’s Supreme Court for her execution. The animosity and anger of Haji Reza was so strong that he personally put the rope around the girl’s delicate neck and personally gave the signal to the crane operator, by raising his hand, to begin pulling the rope.

It may be noted that although according to the Islamic Republic’s own penal laws the presence of an attorney for the defense [is supposed to be] mandatory, regardless of the defendant’s ability to afford one, nevertheless the girl remained without an attorney. Her unfortunate father, while tears poured from his eyes, went about the city beseeching the townspeople for money to hire an attorney who in the least would provide his daughter with a line of defense.

The young girl was buried the same day after her execution but during that same night her corpse was disinterred by unknown individuals and robbed. The theft remains unexplained and the Rajabi family has filed a complaint.

The 16 year old girl’s male companion, who had been arrested as well, received 100 lashes and, after the Islamic punishment was carried out, released.



*Michelle I posted the entire translation because I don't read persian and I don't think most other people here do either. Though I could be wrong.*

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Hailey
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posted 27 August 2004 10:20 AM      Profile for Hailey     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Debra, if you see what I said earlier then you would realize that I wasn't supporting it.

quote:
It still wouldn't make it the right decision.

I was just trying to get a context as I heard things and wasn't sure if they were true.

I'm against capital punishment. I think the only time I ever wavered on that was Andrea Yates but that was a transient shameful expression of anger and I came to my senses. It's always wrong to take another life. The horror of that is heightened by the young women's youthful age.


From: candyland | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
Debra
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posted 27 August 2004 11:40 AM      Profile for Debra   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
But Hailey don't you get that this

quote:
Three months ago, during her appearance before the local court, fiercely angry the young girl hurled insults at the local judge, Haji Reza, who is also the chief judicial administrator of the city, and it is said as another expression of protest took off some of her clothes in the courtroom. This act by the young girl made the administrator so furious that he evaluated her file personally and in less than three months received a go-ahead from the Islamic Republic’s Supreme Court for her execution.

is an appropriate response to what was occurring and was the basis for the "sharp tongue" indictment.

So when you say this

quote:
I understood that the issues were beyond having a sharp tongue and encompassed a concern that she had not been sufficiently chaste. I understand that in an earlier hearing she disrobed and hurled insults at the Judge.

You seem to be missing the point and making allowances for what happened.


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beverly
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posted 27 August 2004 11:44 AM      Profile for beverly     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Andrea Yates You would think about sentencing a clearly mentally incompetent woman to death
From: In my Apartment!!!! | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
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posted 27 August 2004 11:57 AM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
God, tell me about it. If Andrea Yates is the one person in the world, out of all the butchers and murderous thugs out there, that would make someone waver on their anti-capital punishment stance, then that's pretty unbelievable.

Clifford Olson and Paul Bernardo and Charles Manson and all sorts of others like them out there, and the person who makes Hailey have second thoughts about capital punishment is a profoundly disturbed woman who killed her children in a psychotic episode of post-partum depression after her husband, who knew she was severely mentally ill, left her to fend for herself with all the children and housework, and bitched and whined that she wasn't a good enough housekeeper.

Jesus fucking Christ.


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
beverly
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posted 27 August 2004 12:01 PM      Profile for beverly     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Thank you Michelle for putting into words my thoughts.

Actually I was wondering at the time of that where the outrage was about him. She had a problem with each birth but for some reason --- GOD -- I think -- he couldn't use a bloody condum. There was enough blame to go around with that one.... But .... I still don't get it -- fry her but all the other creeps who killed women and children never made you waiver.

I'm anti-death penalty but its the guys like Pickerton that make me waiver.


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Michelle
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posted 27 August 2004 12:02 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
If I remember correctly, he was some sort of religious freak who felt it was his duty to keep her barefoot and pregnant. The asshole. He should be in the next fucking cell.

Don't mind me. Sorry for participating in the thread drift.

We talked about Andrea Yates more in this thread.

[ 27 August 2004: Message edited by: Michelle ]


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Hailey
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posted 27 August 2004 12:15 PM      Profile for Hailey     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
You seem to be missing the point and making allowances for what happened.

I make no allowances. I'm trying to understand the context of the decision. If it was being "sharp tongued" why aren't more women killed there? It's just puzzling to me. The bottom line though is that no matter WHAT she did there is no reason to kill another human being. It is particularly tragic that she's 16 and utterly gruesome that the body has been disposed of.

quote:
Andrea Yates You would think about sentencing a clearly mentally incompetent woman to death

Yes, I did but you must have missed this part of the post transient shameful expression of anger and I came to my senses

quote:
after her husband, who knew she was severely mentally ill, left her to fend for herself with all the children and housework, and bitched and whined that she wasn't a good enough housekeeper.Jesus f-----g Christ.

Clearly, I don't see it from that perspective. I don't blame her husband.

I won't further the thread drift. It was intended as an aside.


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Michelle
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posted 27 August 2004 12:19 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
I make no allowances. I'm trying to understand the context of the decision. If it was being "sharp tongued" why aren't more women killed there? It's just puzzling to me.

Because most women in Iran don't have the guts to be sharp-tongued toward a judge in one of their kangaroo courts, even if they have broken the law there.

I understand that you weren't making allowances. But that really WAS the reason he gave for sentencing her to death. She was rebellious, spoke angrily to the judge, and "disrobed" (which in Iran can mean anything from naked to simply not having your chador hiding your hair).


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 27 August 2004 12:25 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Hailey, you are being -- what's the word? humourless? We know two things: her official offence was HAVING UNAUTHORIZED SEX.

That's bad enough for some religious control-maniacs everywhere and anywhere, but even in Iran, it wouldn't necessarily get her hanged. What incensed the maniac who made sure she got the full penalty was the fact that she defied him, in public. She spoke as a free and independent human being, and if there's one thing control-maniacs cannot stand, that is it, especially if it comes from a woman. A young woman. A single woman.

She will haunt him, God willing. Killing her won't be enough for him. She humiliated him by proving that he can't really control as much as he thinks, and I hope that that memory drives him mad to the end of his life.


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beverly
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posted 27 August 2004 12:26 PM      Profile for beverly     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Yes but Skdadl I don' think Hailey believes in unauthorized sex, if I recall.
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Michelle
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posted 27 August 2004 12:27 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I really admire that girl's guts. She should be considered a folk hero.
From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 27 August 2004 12:29 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Me too. I don't think I would have had the courage, but it is people like that who inspire masses of others.

They can't have your mind. They can kill your body, but they can't have your mind.


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beverly
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posted 27 August 2004 12:32 PM      Profile for beverly     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
They can't have your mind. They can kill your body, but they can't have your mind.

She reminds me of the folks who had the guts to stand up to Hitler, like the White Rose society. And (name eses me) Hungarian woman who actively worked against the Nazis and they broke all fingers and eventually shot her but she wouldn't break or bend for the bastards.

I only hope that someday she will be remembered for being a catalyst for change for the rights of women in Iran.


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skdadl
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posted 27 August 2004 12:38 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The White Rose brother and sister were precisely the people I was thinking of, Beverly.
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Hailey
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posted 27 August 2004 12:38 PM      Profile for Hailey     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Okay, I didn't get the full context of what she was accused of. I was a bit daft.

Just to clarify Beverly I have beliefs about how to live my own life and I would encourage anyone to look at all of their options around becoming sexually active but I'd never condemn two consenting adults.


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lagatta
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posted 27 August 2004 01:45 PM      Profile for lagatta     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
You are thinking of Hans and Sophie Scholl. Here is one of the many There are many websites about them and the other young people in the White Rose website; in Germany, many schools etc are named after them.

As to morality and choices, Hailey, since you say you are a Christian, remember Jesus' admonition that only he or she who was without sin (i.e. nobody) could cast the first stone. I have a friend who works with street kids involved in prostitution and other hustling and petty crime. Their lives are very sad and in many cases, they come from homes where abuse was the norm. In the particular case of the Iranian teen, there was also the issue of whether she was emotionally or mentally competent. A lot of religious folk such as our local hero "Pops" (Father John, a local priest) work with street kids, but they have to learn themselves not to be judgemental.

Here is another local story about a creep exercising his power over a kid: sexual assauling and leaving a ten-year-old girl for dead: http://Montreal.cbc.ca/regional/servlet/View?filename=qc_suspect20040827 What a bastard!

[ 27 August 2004: Message edited by: lagatta ]


From: Se non ora, quando? | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
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posted 27 August 2004 01:56 PM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
A very good friend of mine is originally from Tehran. When that butcher, the Shah, fell, and the religious freaks took over, Nikta (who was ten) and her family fled for Canada, where her mom had a cousin she'd never met.

Nikta was the only one in the family who spoke English, and had to do all the translating for the family once they left Iran. She is a funny, proud, opinionated and very sexy young woman. (She's also the very proud sister of a very "out" lesbian.)

I could not read this account without thinking of Nikta, and seeing her in this young woman's place. I only hope that the people of that town remember the name and the example of courage provided by that young woman. When the counter-revolution comes (please let it be soon!) there should not only be statues raised in her honour and memory, there should be fully-funded scholarships in her name (open only to young women) at every university in Iran.

It almost makes me wish that I DID believe in a god and a hell, because surely a just god would send this cleric to an eternal hell for this foul crime.

It is from the young people like this woman, and in her memory, that the counter-revolution will come. It cannot come soon enough.


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beverly
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posted 27 August 2004 07:04 PM      Profile for beverly     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well said Hep.

Lagatta I wasn't worried about their names, I can't remember the woman's name. But great website.

Never forget.


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Malek
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posted 27 August 2004 09:16 PM      Profile for Malek     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Iran is headed for a counter-revolution in the not so distant future, the scope of which could prove to be frightening within that country. They are an intensely proud and generous people who have suffered long under the burdens of excessive medieval theocracy. It is only because of the peaceful nature of the general population and the understandable fear of authority bought down upon them by their religious leaders that a widespread bloody revolt has not taken place thus far. The desire for a semblance of personal liberty in conjunction with the observance of rational and normal religious practices has been completely ignored by the religious elite in Iran, to their own peril when the right buttons have been pushed.
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Hailey
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posted 27 August 2004 09:27 PM      Profile for Hailey     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well, Lagetta, I think I'll interpret the bible myself thanks but I didn't say anything judgemental. Infact I said whatever two consenting adults do is their business.
From: candyland | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
Debra
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posted 31 August 2004 08:56 PM      Profile for Debra   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
More on the case

http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=137

quote:
A pharmacist, whose shop is not far away from the Railway Square, where Atefeh was hanged, recalls her final, painful hour. “When agents of the State Security Forces brought her to the gallows, I felt cold sweat running down my back. She looked so young and innocent, standing there in the middle of all these bearded men in military fatigues. Judge Reza’i must have felt a personal grudge against her. He put the rope around her neck and left her dangling on the gallows for 45 minutes. I looked around and everyone in the crowd was sobbing and damning the mullahs for doing this to our young people.”

From: The only difference between graffiti & philosophy is the word fuck... | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Trisha
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posted 31 August 2004 10:27 PM      Profile for Trisha     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Ateqeh personally defended herself. She told the religious judge, Haji Rezaii, that he should punish those who force women into adultery, not the victims. The judge used harsh words to scold her for the way she had dressed.

This indicates to me that this may not have been consensual sex. Women in Iran and other countries have been severely punished or killed for being raped in the past.

The way she had dressed could be anything. Maybe she had her face uncovered when it was supposed to be covered. We don't know what rules would have applied to this appearance in court.


From: Thunder Bay, Ontario | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Boinker
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posted 14 September 2004 09:54 PM      Profile for Boinker   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
This type of thing is incomprehensible. But the question I have is does this horrible travesty represent the traditional interpretation and practice of Islam? Or, as some suggested, is it also a perversion and travesty of Islam as it is currently practiced around the world?

Some people I spoke to who had immigrated from Iran explained that religion was being politicized by the power struggle over oil in the mideast and that these extremist barabarisms were reactions to western influences and were aberrations of the true faith.

I would like to believe this but it would not change the fact that Islam is being used to committ the most heinous crimes and few religious authorities in the Islamic community are condemning these types of things.

[ 14 September 2004: Message edited by: Boinker ]


From: The Junction | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Agent 204
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posted 14 September 2004 10:06 PM      Profile for Agent 204   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Horrible travesties tend to arise when you take any centuries-old book as the word of God, whether it's the Koran, the Old or New Testament, the Book of Mormon, or whatever. On the other hand any of these religions can be benign if the texts aren't taken too literally. So in answer to your opening question, I'd say no more or less than Christianity.
From: home of the Guess Who | Registered: Nov 2003  |  IP: Logged
Albireo
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posted 14 September 2004 10:47 PM      Profile for Albireo     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
This is an extreme, unacceptable and despicable case of discrimination against women when they are strong enough to voice and defend their opinions.

There are other more subtle examples in Canada and other parts of the world where women are discriminated against or “socially punished” for their strong opinions and defense of their rights.

Extreme cases like this makes us react in disgust but if you look around it is in your day to day life to a certain degree


Loca posting from Albireo's home....


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