quote:

---

For two weeks, Democrats and their media allies have leveled scorching fire at Sarah Palin. It’s not having much effect, but they keep at it anyway.

* * *

Why do Democrats feel so threatened?

* * *

Basically, it’s this: John McCain only endangers Democratic chances of victory this November, but Sarah Palin is an existential threat to the Democratic Party.

She threatens a core element of the party’s base - women.

* * *

Democrats can’t stomach seeing the feminist movement’s impetus for greater female political participation and empowerment “hijacked” by a pro-life woman who espouses traditional values. They must obliterate her, lest her popularity eat away at their party’s core.

So the Democrats are hysterical in their attacks on her. South Carolina’s Democratic Party chairwoman, Carol Fowler (wife of a national party chairman), said that the only qualification Palin had for vice president was that she hadn’t had an abortion. Tabloids are digging up dirt on Palin’s children. And liberal bloggers have suggested that Palin would neglect her children if she were elected (while the Democratic candidate has young children at home, too).

That liberals would resort to such blatant sexism shows their desperation.

* * *

She’s not popular because she’s a radical feminist or pro-choice advocate. It’s because she understands what it’s like to be a woman in 21st century America.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by George Victor:
In a Munchauseian world bent on self-destruction, I suppose one should not be shocked by this demonstration of mass ignorance. In fact, looking back to another nation's choice of chancellor nearly eight decades back, it's not without precedent.

---

Yes. Of course. Palin = Hitler.

quote:

---

she understands what it’s like to be a woman in 21st century America.

---

And Dickhead Morris knows what that's like. Just because you have a fetish for sucking women's toes, Dick, doesn't meant you know what it's like to be a "woman in 21st century America."

quote:

---

On August 29, 1996, Morris resigned from the Clinton campaign after reports surfaced that he had been involved with a prostitute. A tabloid newspaper had obtained and published a set of photographs of Morris and the woman on a Washington, D.C., hotel balcony. The Daily Telegraph reported that in order to impress the woman, Sherry Rowlands, Morris invited her to listen in on conversations with the President. The Telegraph also alleged that Morris had a preference for "toe-sucking and dominance," and that he regaled Rowlands with a version of "Popeye the Sailor Man," performed in his underpants.

---

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dick_Morris

But have no fear, he's a truly repentant man:

quote:

---

"A number of readers reminded us of the details of his 1996 sex scandal that made the tabloids. But Morris is a changed man since then. He got help for his sexual addiction and also converted to Christianity. He is now an active member of the Catholic Church. Morris also has expressed remorse for helping Bill Clinton.

---

http://conwebwatch.tripod.com/stories/2002/morris.html

And Sven, that you post a column from that moron again only confirms for me your concern troll status.

[ 12 September 2008: Message edited by: josh ]

quote:

---

Originally posted by josh:
And Sven, that you post a column from that moron again only confirms for me your concern troll status.

---

In any event, there's nothing "astute" about Morris. Outside of being a Republican/Faux shill and rabid Clinton hater, he blows with the mind and is usually wrong 9 out of 10 times.

quote:

---

Such a "great political mind" is Morris, in fact, that he predicted Rick Lazio would defeat Hillary Clinton for New York Senate the day before the election. (Hillary, as we all know, won a double-digit victory.) He also predicted Hillary wouldn't run for Senate at all.

Morris, in fact, has a long history of murky prognostication. In 1998, he predicted the Democrats "will absolutely be obliterated" in the midterm elections, losing 30 House seats and five Senate seats. (Democrats wound up gaining five House seats and holding even in the Senate.) He also predicted that five certain Democratic senators might side with the GOP on calling witnesses during Clinton's impeachment trial; all of them voted to dismiss the trial instead.

---

http://conwebwatch.tripod.com/stories/2002/morris.html

[ 12 September 2008: Message edited by: josh ]

quote:

---

Palin is battling allegations that she and her advisers pressured Monegan to fire Wooten. Palin has said she fired Monegan over budget issues and denies any wrongdoing, calling Wooten a "rogue trooper" who threatened her family during his divorce from the governor's sister.

Shea, who says he's an admirer of Palin's, said Thursday that the governor's aides are trying to stall an investigation into Monegan's dismissal by the state Legislature.

"The problem, in my opinion, is that there has been out-and-out cover-up and misleading statements by staffers in the governor's office," he said. "And the parallel that I tried to draw is, you know, the problem with the firing or terminating of the U.S. attorneys."

---

[ 12 September 2008: Message edited by: DrConway ]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Doug:
An animal rights group has taken aim at Sarah Palin with this ad - not a bad effort:

---

Lynda Carter: Sarah Palin is NOT Wonder Woman!

quote:

---

She’s the anti-Wonder Woman. She’s judgmental and dictatorial, telling people how they’ve got to live their lives. And a superior religious self-righteousness ... that’s just not what Wonder Woman is about. Hillary Clinton is a lot more like Wonder Woman than Mrs. Palin. She did it all, didn’t she?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sven:

I suppose she eats weiners, too.

---

[QUOTE]
Originally posted by George Victor:
In a Munchauseian world bent on self-destruction, I suppose one should not be shocked by this demonstration of mass ignorance. In fact, looking back to another nation's choice of chancellor nearly eight decades back, it's not without precedent.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yes. Of course. Palin = Hitler.

[END QUOTE]

quote:

---

Originally posted by josh:
Her refusal to protect the endangered polar bear would also be a good one.

---

Reminds me of this: POLAR BEARS for OBAMA/BIDEN

excerpt:

quote:

---

Originally posted by DrConway:
So in order to prove she can be "one of the men", she'd commit the USA to a war with a country that no nation has successfully invaded without ruinous losses, and which still has nuclear weapons?

---

Article 5 of the North Atlantic Treaty says:

quote:

---

The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all and consequently they agree that, if such an armed attack occurs, each of them, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence recognised by Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, will assist the Party or Parties so attacked by taking forthwith, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area.

Any such armed attack and all measures taken as a result thereof shall immediately be reported to the Security Council. Such measures shall be terminated when the Security Council has taken the measures necessary to restore and maintain international peace and security.

---

The 26 member countries of NATO, as listed on the NATO web site

...and try to find Georgia on the list.

Edit: Maybe Palin, following in the great Bush legacy of idiocy, is thinking of that other Georgia. In which case she's a bit of a dove, if she's only threatening war if they do it a second time.

[ 12 September 2008: Message edited by: Albireo ]

http://www.thepoliticalhub.com/list/19.aspx

h/t bnr

[ 12 September 2008: Message edited by: remind ]

quote:

---

Originally posted by DrConway:
Sure, hide behind the NATO statute that means Georgia could basically play nuclear chicken with Russia. You're purposely missing my point, that regardless of what the treaty says, the "facts on the ground" would tell just about anyone that getting into a long conventional war with Russia is a really bad idea, and a nuclear war with Russia would also be a really bad idea.

---

I suppose Western Europe was "hiding behind" Article 5 for fifty years, too...(and, in fact, it was).

quote:

---

Originally posted by Albireo:
Sven, you are as wise and as knowledgeable as Palin. Yes the NATO agreement says that, but please take a look here:

The 26 member countries of NATO, on the NATO web site

...and try to find Georgia on the list.

---

quote:

---

American intelligence confirms that the latest military actions in South Ossetia were started by Georgia and Russia’s position in the conflict was correct, says Republican California Congressman Dana Rohrabacher. He said the situation reminded him of the Bay of Tonkin incident, which the U.S. used as a pretext for beginning the war in Vietnam.

"The Russians are right! We're wrong! Georgia started it, the Russians ended it," Rohrabacher said at a hearing in the House of Representatives

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sven:
But, if they were members of NATO, they would have the protection of NATO.

---

Also from M. Spector's link above:

quote:

---

Palin said she had insights into U.S. relations with Russia because "they're our next-door neighbors, and you can actually see Russia from land here in Alaska ... from an island in Alaska."

---

[ 12 September 2008: Message edited by: Albireo ]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Albireo:
Sven, you are as wise and as knowledgeable as Palin.

[SNIP]

...and try to find Georgia on the list.

---

Here's the specific exchange between Gibson and Palin on the subject of Georgia and war with Russia:

quote:

---

Originally posted by George Victor:
GIBSON: Would you favor putting Georgia and Ukraine in NATO?

PALIN: Ukraine, definitely, yes. Yes, and Georgia.

GIBSON: Because Putin has said he would not tolerate NATO incursion into the Caucasus.

PALIN: Well, you know, the Rose Revolution, the Orange Revolution, those actions have showed us that those democratic nations, I believe, deserve to be in NATO.

Putin thinks otherwise. Obviously, he thinks otherwise, but...

GIBSON: And under the NATO treaty, wouldn't we then have to go to war if Russia went into Georgia?

---

ETA: I see that Albireo and I cross-posted...

[ 12 September 2008: Message edited by: Sven ]

quote:

---

Originally posted by al-Qa'bong:
OK Sven, put down your pom-poms.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Albireo:
...but by the same token I am an expert on Canada-US relations

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sven:
My point in these comments is that the hysterical comments akin to "Palin looking for war with Russia!!" are made to make her look even less competent on foreign affairs than she already is. I think a simple reporting of the transcript or video suffices...without the hyperbole.

---

Um, so you are objecting to some making Palin look worse than she is? And you are seriously asking people not to?

quote:

---

Originally posted by remind:

Um, so you are objecting to some making Palin look worse than she is? And you are seriously asking people not to?

Goo dluck with that, Palin deserves all she is getting and more.

---

Shrieking hyperbole, particularly in the media, is simply undercutting the credibility of those making such comments.

If you say Palin said, "XYZ" or did "ABC" but Palin didn't say YZ or do BC, it undercuts the speaker's entire credibility, even though Palin said X and did A.

So, really, why are you trying to force that false conceptual framework here?

And BTW you got a good deal of hyperbole going on yourself, what with your use of "shrieking", and "hysterical", while you are calling others on their alleged use of it.

quote:

---

Originally posted by remind:
Do you have links for this hypothesis, or facts that that is what people are saying?

---

Just read the Huffington Post (or even a few MSM newspaper/magazine columnists).

The whole thing, for example, about Palin not knowing what "the" Bush Doctrine is has gotten plenty of play. But, Charles Krauthammer in the Washington Post sliced and diced both Charlie Gibson and the NYTs (and all of the other commentators who rolled their eyes about Palin's "gaffes" about "the" Bush Doctrine).

As I said, the Repubs are famous for it, and do it, as we can see and have seen in respect to ALL Democratic candidates, and towards all people on the left, but yet others should not point out flaws and failings, and give her a break, why? oh, that's right her gender and the fact that she is a 'Mother'.

Sexist asshat that he is.

This says it all and is a good example of him doing what he allegedly was calling out. Plus with the added bonus of sexism.

quote:

---

Yes, Sarah Palin didn't know what it is. But neither does Charlie Gibson. And at least she didn't pretend to know -- while he looked down his nose and over his glasses with weary disdain, sighing and "sounding like an impatient teacher," as the Times noted. In doing so, he captured perfectly the establishment snobbery and intellectual condescension that has characterized the chattering classes' reaction to the mother of five who presumes to play on their stage.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sven:

Shrieking hyperbole, particularly in the media, is simply undercutting the credibility of those making such comments.

If you say Palin said, "XYZ" or did "ABC" but Palin didn't say YZ or do BC, it undercuts the speaker's entire credibility, even though Palin said X and did A.

It's just astounding to me the half-truths and hyperbole I've been reading about Palin in the media. The public reads or listens to it and say, "Well, what you said here is clearly not accurate or true" and many will just tune out all criticism entirely (even the criticism that is factually correct or legitimately justified).

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by josh:
Why don't you just come out and say you support Palin instead of continuing this charade.

---

Actually, I think she's a horrible pick for the country...specifically for foreign policy reasons. She may know basic "talking points" but, I fear, that's it. Foreign policy is too critical to be handed over to someone who (1) has so little knowledge about foreign policy and (and this is the real kicker) (2) has shown very little past interest in the subject. Most politicians who are running for president and vice president have a very active interest in foreign affairs matters and have spent a considerable amount of time thinking about it, even if they have little actual experience with foreign affairs.

[ 13 September 2008: Message edited by: Sven ]

quote:

---

Most politicians who are running for president and vice president have a very active interest in foreign affairs matters and have spent a considerable amount of time thinking about it, even if they have little actual experience with foreign affairs.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sven:
I suppose Western Europe was "hiding behind" Article 5 for fifty years, too...(and, in fact, it was).

---

Ahem, no. Board the failboat.

At no time did a country like, say, West Germany, get into an open, armed conflict with an Eastern Bloc neighbor, such as, say, Czechoslovakia, or even start a belligerent war of words over territorial claims which then expanded into armed conflict with the potential for nuclear war.

quote:

---

My point in these comments is that the hysterical comments akin to "Palin looking for war with Russia!!" are made to make her look even less competent on foreign affairs than she already is. I think a simple reporting of the transcript or video suffices...without the hyperbole.

---

NYT's Article on the flury of 'untruths'.

NYT

quote:

---

McCain Barbs Stirring Outcry as Distortions

McCain Barbs Stirring Outcry as Distortions
By MICHAEL COOPER and JIM RUTENBERG

Harsh advertisements and negative attacks are a staple of presidential campaigns, but Senator John McCain has drawn an avalanche of criticism this week from Democrats, independent groups and even some Republicans for regularly stretching the truth in attacking Senator Barack Obama’s record and positions.

Mr. Obama has also been accused of distortions, but this week Mr. McCain has found himself under particularly heavy fire for a pair of headline-grabbing attacks. First the McCain campaign twisted Mr. Obama’s words to suggest that he had compared Gov. Sarah Palin, the Republican vice-presidential nominee, to a pig after Mr. Obama said, in questioning Mr. McCain’s claim to be the change agent in the race, “You can put lipstick on a pig; it’s still a pig.” (Mr. McCain once used the same expression to describe Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton’s health plan.)

Then he falsely claimed that Mr. Obama supported “comprehensive sex education” for kindergartners (he supported teaching them to be alert for inappropriate advances from adults).

Those attacks followed weeks in which Mr. McCain repeatedly, and incorrectly, asserted that Mr. Obama would raise taxes on the middle class, even though analysts say he would cut taxes on the middle class more than Mr. McCain would, and misrepresented Mr. Obama’s positions on energy and health care.

A McCain advertisement called “Fact Check” was itself found to be “less than honest” by FactCheck.org, a nonpartisan group. The group complained that the McCain campaign had cited its work debunking various Internet rumors about Ms. Palin and implied in the advertisement that the rumors had originated with Mr. Obama.

......

---

[ 13 September 2008: Message edited by: ElizaQ ]

quote:

---

McCain’s tactics are drawing the scorn of many in the media and organizations tasked with fact-checking the truthfulness of campaigns. In recent weeks, Team McCain has been described as dishonorable, disingenuous and downright cynical.

. . . .

Current campaign aides and other Republicans who’ve closely watched the race, however, have a very different response to the media elites and good-government scolds: We don’t care what you think.

McCain seems to have made a choice that many politicians succumb to but that he had always promised to avoid — he appears ready to do whatever it takes to win, even it if soils his reputation.

---

http://tinyurl.com/68vwso

DRILL, DRILL, DRILL
I am having Sarah Palin nightmares. I dreamt last night that she was a member of a club where they rode snowmobiles and wore the claws of drowned and starved polar bears around their necks.
I have a particular thing for Polar Bears. Maybe it's their snowy whiteness or their bigness or the fact that they live in the arctic or that I have never seen one in person or touched one.
Maybe it is the fact that they live so comfortably on ice. Whatever it is, I need the polar bears.

I don't like raging at women. I am a Feminist and have spent my life trying to build community, help empower women and stop violence against them. It is hard to write about Sarah Palin.
This is why the Sarah Palin choice was all the more insidious and cynical.
The people who made this choice count on the goodness and solidarity of Feminists.
But everything Sarah Palin believes in and practices is antithetical to Feminism which for me is part of one story -- connected to saving the earth, ending racism, empowering women, giving young girls options, opening our minds, deepening tolerance, and ending violence and war.

I believe that the McCain/Palin ticket is one of the most dangerous choices of my lifetime, and should this country choose those candidates the fall-out may be so great, the destruction so vast in so many areas that America may never recover.
But what is equally disturbing is the impact that duo would have on the rest of the world.
Unfortunately, this is not a joke. In my lifetime I have seen the clownish, the inept, the bizarre be elected to the presidency with regularity. Sarah Palin does not believe in evolution. I take this as a metaphor.
In her world and the world of Fundamentalists nothing changes or gets better or evolves.
She does not believe in global warming. The melting of the arctic, the storms that are destroying our cities, the pollution and rise of cancers, are all part of God's plan. She is fighting to take the polar bears off the endangered species list.
The earth, in Palin's view, is here to be taken and plundered. The wolves and the bears are here to be shot and plundered.
The oil is here to be taken and plundered. Iraq is here to be taken and plundered.
As she said herself of the Iraqi war, "It was a task from God."

Sarah Palin does not believe in abortion. She does not believe women who are raped and incested and ripped open against their will should have a right to determine whether they have their rapist's baby or not. She obviously does not believe in sex education or birth control. I imagine her daughter was practicing abstinence and we know how many babies that makes.

Sarah Palin does not much believe in thinking. From what I gather she has tried to ban books from the library, has a tendency to dispense with people who think independently. She cannot tolerate an environment of ambiguity and difference.
This is a woman who could and might very well be the next president of the United States.
She would govern one of the most diverse populations on the earth.
Sarah believes in guns.
She has her own custom Austrian hunting rifle.
She has been known to kill 40 caribou at a clip.
She has shot hundreds of wolves from the air.
Sarah believes in God.
That is of course her right, her private right.
But when God and Guns come together in the public sector, when war is declared in God's name, when the rights of women are denied in his name, that is the end of separation of church and
state and the undoing of everything America has ever tried to be.
I write to my sisters. I write because I believe we hold this election in our hands.
This vote is a vote that will determine the future not just of the U.S., but of the planet.
It will determine whether we create policies to save the earth or make it forever uninhabitable for humans.
It will determine whether we move towards dialogue and diplomacy in the world or whether we escalate violence through invasion, undermining and attack. It will determine whether we go for oil, strip mining, coal burning or invest our money in alternatives that will free us from dependency and destruction.
It will determine if money gets spent on education and healthcare or whether we build more and more methods of killing.
It will determine whether America is a free open tolerant society or a closed place of fear, fundamentalism and aggression.
If the Polar Bears don't move you to go and do everything in your power to get Obama elected then consider the chant that filled the hall after Palin spoke at the RNC, "Drill Drill Drill."
I think of teeth when I think of drills. I think of rape. I think of destruction. I think of domination.
I think of military exercises that force mindless repetition, emptying the brain of analysis, doubt, ambiguity or dissent.
I think of pain.

Do we want a future of drilling? More holes in the ozone, in the floor of the sea, more holes in our thinking, in the trust between nations and peoples, more holes in the fabric of this precious thing we call life?

Eve Ensler

[ 14 September 2008: Message edited by: martin dufresne ]

Hundreds Show for Anti-Palin Rally

quote:

---

The protest came about two hours after Palin delivered a rousing speech at Anchorage's new convention center before leaving the state to return to the campaign trail. Palin was named John McCain's running mate on Aug. 29. This was her first return since then to her home state.
......................
Anne Applegate-Scott, a 44-year-old attorney and stay-at-home mom, held a sign that said, "I don't vote for liars." Applegate-Scott said she actually voted for Palin for governor but won't vote for the McCain-Palin ticket. Palin, she thinks, has become a "product" of McCain handlers and won't let her talk to the media.

When she does talk, Applegate-Scott accused Palin of lying about her record.

"She lied about her position on earmarks and building the bridge," Applegate-Scott said referring to the infamous Bridge to Nowhere. "She talks about her being a feminist but it is convenient feminism, it doesn't cost her anything."

---

[/QUOTE]Washington Post Article on Rally
Alaska Women Reject Palin Rally is Huge

quote:

---

The rally was organized by a small group of women, talking over coffee. It made me wonder what other things have started with small groups of women talking over coffee. It’s probably an impressive list. These women hatched the plan, printed up flyers, posted them around town, and sent notices to local media outlets. One of those media outlets was KBYR radio, home of Eddie Burke, a long-time uber-conservative Anchorage talk show host. Turns out that Eddie Burke not only announced the rally, but called the people who planned to attend the rally “a bunch of socialist baby-killing maggots”, and read the home phone numbers of the organizers aloud over the air, urging listeners to call and tell them what they thought. The women, of course, received many nasty, harassing and threatening messages.
............

Never, have I seen anything like it in my 17 and a half years living in Anchorage. The organizers had someone walk the rally with a counter, and they clicked off well over 1400 people (not including the 90 counter-demonstrators). This was the biggest political rally ever, in the history of the state. I was absolutely stunned. The second most amazing thing is how many people honked and gave the thumbs up as they drove by. And even those that didn’t honk looked wide-eyed and awe-struck at the huge crowd that was growing by the minute. This just doesn’t happen here.
...........
So, if you’ve been doing the math… Yes. The Alaska Women Reject Palin rally was significantly bigger than Palin’s rally that got all the national media coverage! So take heart, sit back, and enjoy the photo gallery. Feel free to spread the pictures around (links are appreciated) to anyone who needs to know that Sarah Palin most definitely does not speak for all Alaskans. The citizens of Alaska, who know her best, have things to say.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by aka Mycroft:
Tina Fey really nailed her Palin impression down pat on SNL last night. The voice was right on.

---

quote:

---

...The Governor and her staff were watching from 30,000 feet.

Palin was on board her campaign jet flying from Reno to Denver as 11:30 PM Eastern rolled around. But the show was available on the Jetblue charter's satellite TV system.

Standing alongside SNL cast member Amy Poehler who was impersonating Hillary Clinton, Fey's Palin extolled her foreign policy expertise in a flat midwestern accent: "I can see Russia from my house!"

There were howls of laughter from the sizeable press corps covering Palin's first foray on the campaign trail without her running man as a chaperone.

But, from the front of the plane, silence. The flight attendants assured us Palin and her entourage were watching. What she thought, though, is anybody's guess.

Palin has yet to say so much as hello to the press corps.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by aka Mycroft:
Tina Fey really nailed her Palin impression down pat on SNL last night. The voice was right on.

---

quote:

---

Neoconservatives plan Project Sarah Palin to shape future American foreign policy

Neoconservatives whose influence had been waning in Washington have hitched their colours to rising star Sarah Palin in a bid to shape US foreign policy for another decade.

By Tim Shipman in Wasilla, Alaska

Comments by the governor of Alaska in her first television interview, in which she said Nato may have to go to war with Russia and took a tough line on Iran's nuclear programme, were the result of two weeks of briefings by neoconservatives.

Sources in the McCain camp, the Republican Party and Washington think tanks say Mrs Palin was identified as a potential future leader of the neoconservative cause in June 2007. That was when the annual summer cruise organised by the right-of-centre Weekly Standard magazine docked in Juneau, the Alaskan state capital, and the pundits on board took tea with Governor Palin.

.........
A former Republican White House official, who now works at the American Enterprise Institute, a bastion of Washington neoconservatism, admitted: "She's bright and she's a blank page. She's going places and it's worth going there with her."

Asked if he sees her as a "project", the former official said: "Your word, not mine, but I wouldn't disagree with the sentiment."

Pat Buchanan, the former Republican presidential candidate and a foreign policy isolationist, who opposes the war in Iraq, the project most closely associated with the neocons, said: "Palin has become, overnight, the most priceless political asset the movement has.

"Look for the neocons to move with all deliberate speed to take her into their camp by pressing upon her advisers and staff, and steering her into the AEI-Weekly Standard-War Party orbit." The AEI, or American Enterprise Institute, is a free-market think-tank with many neo-cons among its members.

In the two weeks since she was named as Mr McCain's running mate that is just what has happened. While Mr McCain was publicly distancing himself from the policies and personalities of the Bush administration, Mrs Palin was sequestered with a series of former aides to George W. Bush.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by aka Mycroft:
Tina Fey really nailed her Palin impression down pat on SNL last night. The voice was right on.

---

quote:

---

Democrats, exquisitely sensitized to the footfalls of defeat by the disasters of 2000 and 2004, caught the first menacing chords of impending disaster last weekend and have been panicking ever since.

The hours they had to revel in the apparent success of their Denver convention and Obama’s big speech were pitifully brief. The very next day John McCain picked as his running mate a virtually unknown governor from Alaska and the country has gone Palin-crazy ever since.

Ignoring Obama’s solemn appeals for unity, America has become joyously divided. Evangelicals, braced by Palin’s Christian faith, have risen spryly from the bed of their indifference to McCain, a man whose relationship to the Holy Spirit is remote. Now their champion is an accredited bible-thumper, in whom the Holy Spirit burns as brightly as natural gas flares over the Arctic tundra.

Liberals, particularly women, maddened at the spectacle of attractive Governor Sarah embodying everything they loathe, flood the internet with frantic oaths and seize on every particle of gossip from Alaska suggesting that Palin is a hypocrite, a mismanager, a would-be burner of books, a bad mother and untrue to her man. Those scoffing only a few short weeks ago at the National Enquirer’s “mere unverified gossip” about John Edward’s affair, now hasten to the supermarkets to snatch up the Enquirer’s latest allegations about Palin and her family.

As the political news circuits began to buzz with news of improved polling numbers for McCain-Palin in the battleground states, Obama’s ascent towards the status of a Sure Bet is stalled. After the triumphs of Denver the candidate relapsed into the nerveless mode of early August. He had the poor judgment to go on the cable news show of Fox’s Bill O’Reilly and make the extraordinary statement that the so-called Surge in Iraq had “succeeded beyond our wildest dreams”. He calls for 10,000 more troops for Afghanistan. Move over, Sarah Palin! You only want to shoot wolves from helicopters. Real men like Obama want more helicopter gunships to mow down Afghan kids from the air.

---

quote:

---

What Palin so seductively represents...is a form of feminine power that is utterly digestible to those who have no intellectual or political use for actual women. It's like some dystopian future ... feminism without any feminists.

---

quote:

---

In this strange new pro-woman tableau, feminism -- a word that is being used all over the country with regard to Palin's potential power -- means voting for someone who would limit reproductive control, access to healthcare and funding for places like Covenant House Alaska, an organization that helps unwed teen mothers. It means cheering someone who allowed women to be charged for their rape kits while she was mayor of Wasilla, who supports the teaching of creationism alongside evolution, who has inquired locally about the possibility of using her position to ban children's books from the public library, who does not support the teaching of sex education.

In this "Handmaid's Tale"-inflected universe, in which femininity is worshipped but females will be denied rights, CNBC pundit Donny Deutsch tells us that we're witnessing "a new creation ... of the feminist ideal," the feminism being so ideal because instead of being voiced by hairy old bats with unattractive ideas about intellect and economy and politics and power, it's now embodied by a woman who, according to Deutsch, does what Hillary Clinton did not: "put a skirt on." "I want her watching my kids," says Deutsch. "I want her laying next to me in bed."

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by just one of the concerned:
That's true. Who's defending obama?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sven:
"Why Feminists Hate Sarah Palin" by Cathy Young.

I think that title is a bit too absolute. It would be more accurate to say, "Why Many Feminists Hate the Idea of Sarah Palin".

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Sven,

Do you actually read the WSJ or do you find the links from other online communities where you hang out?

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Originally posted by 500_Apples:
I tried reading the article you linked to but by the end of the first paragraph I was like, too predictable.

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Originally posted by Sven:

It was "too predictable" because you've read similar columns by Cathy Young?

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It's standard oversimplified populist right-wing spin.

It starts with:

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Left-wing feminists have a hard time dealing with strong, successful conservative women in politics such as Margaret Thatcher. Sarah Palin seems to have truly unhinged more than a few, eliciting a stream of vicious, often misogynist invective.

On Salon.com last week, Cintra Wilson branded her a "Christian Stepford Wife" and a "Republican blow-up doll." Wendy Doniger, religion professor at the University of Chicago Divinity School, added on the Washington Post blog, "Her greatest hypocrisy is in her pretense that she is a woman."

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zzzZZZzzzZZZzzz

Methodology:

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Originally posted by Polunatic2:
Dubya didn't. Like Palin, he had never had a passport until just before the election.

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Originally posted by 500_Apples:
It's standard oversimplified populist right-wing spin.

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I'm afraid your critique is "standard oversimplified populist left-wing spin".

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Originally posted by Sven:

I'm afraid your critique is "standard oversimplified populist left-wing spin".

Young has strong (small L) libertarian leanings (socially liberal but fiscally conservative).

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Originally posted by Sven:

It was "too predictable" because you've read similar columns by Cathy Young?

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Originally posted by 500_Apples:
Did you find any of her points insightful and thought provoking?

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Actually, yes.

I’ve said for a long time that equality between genders will require, as a precondition, gender equality at home. As long as women have to bear twice the burden at home as men do, women will always be at a significant disadvantage.

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Originally posted by josh:
No, because it was on the WSJ op-ed page. Where strawmen, and women, and bashing anyone left of Dick Cheney, thrive.

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Originally posted by Sven:

Actually, yes.

I’ve said for a long time that equality between genders will require, as a precondition, gender equality at home. As long as women have to bear twice the burden at home as men do, women will always be at a significant disadvantage.

Young notes that Palin represents that kind of home (with her husband bearing a very large percentage of home responsibilities—he’s not working outside of the home at all now) and that that is a good model (essentially for the reasons I noted).

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Originally posted by Sven:

Actually, yes.

I’ve said for a long time that equality between genders will require, as a precondition, gender equality at home. As long as women have to bear twice the burden at home as men do, women will always be at a significant disadvantage.

Young notes that Palin represents that kind of home (with her husband bearing a very large percentage of home responsibilities—he’s not working outside of the home at all now) and that that is a good model (essentially for the reasons I noted).

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Do you really find this insightful and thought provoking?

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Mrs. Palin's marriage actually makes her a terrific role model. One of the best choices a woman can make if she wants a career and a family is to pick a partner who will be able to take on equal or primary responsibility for child-rearing. Our culture still harbors a lingering perception that such men are less than manly -- and who better to smash that stereotype than "First Dude" Todd Palin?

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That is incredibly small-minded and uninsightful.

It's great and fabulous that Palin has:

1) A job that can support a large family on a single large income.
2) A husband who has job flexibility and can go on leave and take care of the kids.

The reason that's not an "terrific" role model, as the predictable Cathy young calls it, is that it is not realistic under the current economic framework, which is why government intervention is necessary. If governments were run like the private sector, Palin would not be making 82, 000; she'd be making 0.73* 82, 000 = 59, 860, with fewer job benefits. Then, Alaska is more subsidized than the rest of the country and has tremendous oil wealth, such that Alaska residents pay negative income taxes. And the list goes on. In these two ways and others, Palin who is argued to be the example of superb motherhood without government help, is actually an example of facilitated motherhood due to government help.

The WSJ article is no surprise, full of crap.

ETA: If she becomes VEEP her salary will be 209, 000/year, http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0875856.html, certainly enough to support a family of five kids and two parents on one income... even without the job perks I can't even conceive of.

[ 15 September 2008: Message edited by: 500_Apples ]

Goodman's thesis is about how her as a 'supermom
is being used politically and the hypocrisy behind it, not some sort of 'as a feminist I hate you' scree.

So onto Marsh, hmm yep...not exactly what Young portrays it to be either.

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So Young says: Yet some feminists unabashedly suggest that her decision to seek the vice presidency makes her a bad and selfish mother. Others argue that she is bad for working mothers because she's just too good at having it all.

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Then gives to examples of 'feminists' opinions suggesting that's what they think. Which if you actually read the pieces she's referring to that's not what they are saying at all.
Yes I have heard women speaking about Palin, about her motherhood and being selfish and yes some of those women are from the 'left'. Some may even be self proclaimed feminists. These woman aren't saying that though. On the other hand I have heard and read similar things from both women and me on the Right, mostly from Christian right circles. I believe Goodman comments a bit about the hypocrisy on that point.

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Young:Not to Ms. Marsh, who insists that feminism must demand support for women from the government.

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Uh no she didn't. Not even close. Marsh is talking about actual women, not some demands of some sort of 'feminism or intellectual feminist theory.

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I disagree with Sarah Palin on a number of issues, including abortion rights. But when the feminist establishment treats not only pro-life feminism but small-government, individualist feminism as heresy, it writes off multitudes of women.

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Here's where I both agree and disagree. She's right but she's also missing what many of the women she's referring to as 'writing off' multitudes of woman are saying. Which essentially that Palin image of 'woman', which sorry just isn't Palin but in the case of the election, a political creation, is writing off multitudes of women and that's where the 'kick in the gut is'. It really has little to do with Palin herself.
Some have reacted quite strongly and I've read some stuff which I do find quite appalling and 'unfemnismist' (for lack of better generalization).
The reaction though, has more to do with how the political aspects are being used. Not with who she is. This new 'vision' of feminism, isn't new or 'woman' isn't new. It's just suddenly become politically expedient so ergo 'new' and exciting. It's as if there is this new discovery on some sort of uncharted territory.
Which in a way I suppose it is, it's uncharted in the Republican mindset. So in this case I can say well good, even though I find it rife with the hypocrisy of it being used as strategically as it is. It is really irksome for instance how people like Dick Morris and Sean Hannity are now giving America lectures on the rampart sexism in society when just a few months ago they were bantering back and forth about women, eg Clinton, whining and not being able to take the heat and hiding behind apron strings, or Dobson's, who now lurvs Palin true feelings on women's place and traditional roles, McCain's sexist jokes and blah blah. I would absolutely love Palin to take people like that to task and call it for what it is as well as this partisan crap. That's doubtful though if the rhetoric around the press and critizism is any indication.
As Goodman points out, at least the working mom as been pushed out of the firing line. At least maybe.

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McCain spokeswoman Carly Fiorina has weighed in on the major issue of today, namely, 30 Rock creator Tina Fey's portrayal of vice presidential contender Sarah Palin from this weekend's Saturday Night Live. Fiorina, astonishingly, termed it "disrespectful." Because that's what SNL does - paint flattering pictures of political figures. You'd think she'd be immune to such concerns, or at least not humorless about it -- after all, the very candidate she supports went on SNL last season

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Originally posted by M. Spector:
In many ways, Traister’s words could apply equally to Obama: “What Obama so seductively represents…is a form of black power that is utterly digestible to those who have no intellectual or political use for actual black people. It's like some dystopian future ... black power without any blacks.”

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Originally posted by remind:
McCain's adviser called Tina fey's skit "disrespectful and sexist". :bigeyes: Unbelievable, seriously!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/

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Originally posted by Kevin Laddle:
Not that I haven't been appalled by Obama's hypocrisy, war-mongering, and appeassing of the right-wing this campaign... But why should he have to live up to what other's idea of "black" is in order to be considered an authentic?

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Originally posted by M. Spector:
Why should Sarah Palin have to live up to what others' idea of "feminine" is in order to be considered an authentic?

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[ 16 September 2008: Message edited by: martin dufresne ]

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Originally posted by josh:
No, because it was on the WSJ op-ed page. Where strawmen, and women, and bashing anyone left of Dick Cheney, thrive.

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Originally posted by Sven:
Well, you obviously don't read the WSJ. The editorial board opinions are definitely conservative (more libertarian, actually). But, as anyone who reads the Journal knows, non-editorial board columnists are not all of the same political stripe.

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Originally posted by M. Spector:
Why should Sarah Palin have to live up to what others' idea of "feminine" is in order to be considered an authentic?

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Republican vice presidential candidate Sarah Palin will meet with foreign leaders next week at the United Nations, a move to boost her foreign-policy credentials, a Republican strategist said.

Republican candidate John McCain plans to introduce the Alaska governor to heads of state at the opening of the U.N. General Assembly, although specific names weren’t yet firmed up. “The meetings will give her some exposure and experience with foreign leaders,” the strategist said. “It’s a great idea.”
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But McCain advisers hope her U.N. visit will show how quickly Palin can make key connections and become well-versed in foreign-policy issues.

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PALIN DOESN'T WEAR LIPSTICK

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Originally posted by kropotkin1951:
After watching this going on in the Excited States I have come to the conclusion that:

PALIN DOESN'T WEAR LIPSTICK

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Let's get back to substantive problems like the fact that Sarah Palin's "feminist" credentials are pretty thin on the ground when she's got legions of paid peons who can take her of her kid Trig while she'll plant her well-paid self in the Veep's seat and pretend she isn't waiting for the old man's ticker to quit. Or consider how she made it so women would have to pay for their own rape kits. Real swell there, Ms Palin.

Ask any ordinary woman with a child who has Downs syndrome how much extra help she has been able to get for her child and how many people she had to cajole and bully into doing it.

(A personal note: As a private person who has a hearing loss, I am personally offended at Palin's use of a disabled child for political point-scoring. If I knew that I'd been paraded around as a young child for something that was wholly my parents' benefit, I'd probably be the teeniest bit hacked off about it.)

[ 16 September 2008: Message edited by: DrConway ]

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Let's get back to substantive problems like the fact that Sarah Palin's "feminist" credentials are pretty thin ...

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Originally posted by DrConway:
Do you two work at plumbing the depths of unfunny?

Let's get back to substantive problems like the fact that Sarah Palin's "feminist" credentials are pretty thin on the ground when she's got legions of paid peons who can take her of her kid Trig while she'll plant her well-paid self in the Veep's seat and pretend she isn't waiting for the old man's ticker to quit. Or consider how she made it so women would have to pay for their own rape kits. Real swell there, Ms Palin.

[ 16 September 2008: Message edited by: DrConway ]

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OK - I agree with you the rape kits - absolutely frightening and ridiculous to even consider as a woman.

But how the hell is paying for childcare nto feminist? How do you think women with young children work? They pay people. How do you think women with young children with disabilities work? They pay people. If you are saying paying for child care is not feminist - you are out to lunch.

Jesus, this is getting sickening.

Once again, Sarah Palin is about feminism as Log Cabin Rethugicans are about gay rights.

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Originally posted by Ghislaine:
But how the hell is paying for childcare nto feminist? How do you think women with young children work? They pay people. How do you think women with young children with disabilities work? They pay people. If you are saying paying for child care is not feminist - you are out to lunch.

and ps she apparently has a stay-at-home husband now who said he is going on leave from his job.

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That's precisely the point I'm making.

How many mothers of special needs children do you know have access to fully subsidized childcare, plus a husband that doesn't have to work to pay the family bills?

Last I looked, special needs childcare often took up a decent chunk of a family budget and a lot of families these days are double-income. She's got enough cash to not have to worry about it as much.

Like I said in my rhetorical question (or perhaps it is not so rhetorical now!) above, how many mothers of special needs children do you know who have had to cajole, bully, etc and in general be the squeaky wheel almost to the detriment of their own health, in order that their child be given the proper supports needed to give the child as high a quality of life as is possible in a peaceful and reasonably wealthy country with the resources and infrastructure to do so?

In short, Palin has highly specialized circumstances that do not match up with the majority of people in her target audience.

[ 17 September 2008: Message edited by: DrConway ]

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But how the hell is paying for childcare nto feminist?

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How do you think women with young children work? They pay people. How do you think women with young children with disabilities work? They pay people. If you are saying paying for child care is not feminist - you are out to lunch.

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WASHINGTON - Women's rights groups endorsed Barack Obama for president Tuesday, asserting the historic selection of a female Republican vice presidential candidate does not make up for John McCain's lack of support on issues important to women.
"We don't think it's much to break a glass ceiling for one woman and leave millions of women behind," said Eleanor Smeal, president of the Feminist Majority Foundation.
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Obama also won the support of the National Organization for Women, which said it has not endorsed a candidate for president since Walter Mondale and Geraldine Ferraro shared the Democratic ticket in 1984.
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The McCain campaign said it was unhappy with NOW's decision to endorse Obama in the race for the White House.

"It's extremely disappointing that an organization that purports to be an advocate for all women not only opposes, but feels compelled to go out of its way to criticize and make negative comments, about the only ticket in the presidential race with a woman on the ticket," Palin's spokeswoman Maria Comella said in an e-mail.

Smeal said the organizations have and will continue to protest any sexism in the presidential campaign, but she added, "We think it's time to get off issues such as lipstick and on to the issues, really, that are challenging this nation."

Gandy criticized Republicans for changing their tone on sexism.

"I love it that Republicans have discovered sexism in the media," she said. "Because they didn't see any of it when it was being directed at Hillary Clinton. But once Sarah Palin got a dose of it, which we also pointed out, they were all over it." She did not explain how her group defended Palin from sexism.

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Originally posted by bigcitygal:

Um, absolutely not. Many poor and working-class women who have to work outside the home for pay make arrangements with family members, work different shifts than their partners if they have them, enlist neighbours and older children.

And why do they do this? Because there is no free, or very inexpensive, quality childcare available for children of all levels of ability. And who do we have to thank for that? Right wingers such as Palin.

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I did not say that Palin is a feminist - obviously she is not. I was responding to Dr Conway's comment that paying for childcare is not feminist.

I read his comment as implying that if she were a true feminist she would be paying someone else to be looking after her kids.

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"It's extremely disappointing that an organization that purports to be an advocate for all women not only opposes, but feels compelled to go out of its way to criticize and make negative comments, about the only ticket in the presidential race with a woman on the ticket," Palin's spokeswoman Maria Comella said in an e-mail.

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"I love it that Republicans have discovered sexism in the media," she said. "Because they didn't see any of it when it was being directed at Hillary Clinton. But once Sarah Palin got a dose of it, which we also pointed out, they were all over it."

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ElizaQ, thanks for this.

Here's a piece from SNL with "Palin" and "Clinton". There are some problematic sexist parts, so I'm not endorsing this wholeheartedly, but they got a few very good points in.

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Originally posted by Ghislaine:
I read his comment as implying that if she were a true feminist she would be paying someone else to be looking after her kids.

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Ahem, no.

What I meant was that she would be endorsing the same kind of privilege that allows her to more easily bear the burden of raising a special-needs child, which is to say, subsidized and affordable and timely access to all the services he or she will need over the course of his or her lifetime.

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Originally posted by bigcitygal:

ElizaQ, thanks for this.

Here's a piece from SNL with "Palin" and "Clinton". There are some problematic sexist parts, so I'm not endorsing this wholeheartedly, but they got a few very good points in.

Palin and Clinton on SNL

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I found that hilarious - particularly Poeler's portrayal of Hilary Clinton.

Also I do find the campaigns comment about 'getting away' from lipstick quite ironic, for one they are the ones that pushed the whole 'Obama called Palin a pig with lipstick' ads that they being admonished for right now plus they are the ones that brought the whole thing up in the first place and don't really seem to be quelling.
Sarahfernalia

I linked to that blog in a previous post about the Anti-Palin rally. I do really recommend it. For me it's probably one of the most interesting places to get info of whats going on for a number of reasons.
This blog owner started it before there was any real inkling about the nominations as commentary on Alaska politics in general. It seems pretty solid in that regard and has been consistently ahead of the news on Palin issues since the beginning. It's bias is obvious but it's not over the top crappy propaganda stuff. It's done with humor to from people who are actually living it and know more about the inside scoop.
The other reason why I find it interesting is watching how it's just blossomed so that now people from all over the US and the world are coming there daily to talk about what's going on. The blog posts are one thing, the comments the best part though with links being posted to everything.

It also appears to be more heavy on the female side of posters which with all of this academic talk flying around the news about Palin is actually to me at least, refreshing to get perspectives from
just the average people involved in the election. It's more then just political 'talking points' flying back and forth.

This blog on the rally was the source of the story that eventually went to the MSN news and in the comment section you can literally watch that happen and as it spread everywhere and see more and more people popping on to say mostly 'thank thank you guys this is so inspiring' from all over the lower 48. I don't think this would have gotten out at all if it wasn't posted there. This really is an example of how the internet postings of an average person can effect what goes on in elections.
It's not just talk though, people are actually organizing through it as well.

The blog owner has posted that they have to update the site because in less then 2 weeks they've got over 2 million hits and the numbers are rising faster then they can keep up. She installed a pretty neat map widget last night that shows graphically where people are and it is the entire world.

Right now the whole 'TrooperGate' thing is in the news and there's some excellent insight into the fanangling that the Repub campaign is doing around now that they are involved from people who actually live in Alaska and know Alaska politics.

[ 17 September 2008: Message edited by: ElizaQ ]