Tonight, Michelle Obama speaks. Ted Kennedy will make an appearance and will be honoured with tributes.

ETA: The interviewer talking to Bernstein said that while Hillary has promised to fully back Obama, she nevertheless is "conflicted" about this. Holy cow - how can anyone say that without actually being Hillary? I think CNN should reassign that interviewer, whoever it was (I didn't catch the name).

[ 25 August 2008: Message edited by: Boom Boom ]

quote:

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Carl Bernstein was just on CNN talking about the Clintons. He says Hillary has to deliver a barnstormer speech backing Obama to assure herself of a future in this party, and Bill has to deliver a speech that will restore his legacy which has been badly tarnished in the recent campaign.

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Originally posted by It's Me D:
I suppose they'll need to be well positioned after McCain wins.

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ETA: the network is also reporting there's a noisy pro-Clinton demonstration outside the convention building.

[ 25 August 2008: Message edited by: Boom Boom ]

Forty years later, history could be about to repeat itself:

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On Monday, Denver police spent the day intimidating and provoking peaceful protesters. By day's end there were entirely too many police with too much time on their hands. They were eager to arrest people in Denver. It didn't matter if the people were simply walking down the street. Medics were even detained.

Flashing a wide variety of weapons, Denver police positioned police gangs around the peaceful Food Not Bombs. Police even made a single file procession through the heart of Food Not Bombs' peaceful dinner. As people were eating, Denver police made one of the silliest processions ever through a dinner of rice and lentils.

After spending the late afternoon in bizarre staging and intimidation tactics in the Civic Center area, Denver police began spraying people with pepper spray and shoving people randomly by day's end. Finally, apparently bored and itchy to arrest, they arrested people for their Democratic National Convention dog cages. It was a sad and embarrassing day for Denver police, proving that lawlessness reigns for US police.

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Video: Police trap peaceful protesters in Denver

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After trapping the crowd between two buildings, hundreds of officers used pepper spray, batons and unwarranted aggression. After being surrounded for 20 minutes, two ANP producers managed to escape after recording the whole affair.

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When police surrounded several dozen people pinned against the wall of a building, a crowd of several hundred protesters surged up to the police line from behind chanting, "They say get back, we say fight back."

The protesters near the building were held there by riot police for an hour, while individuals were taken from the group and arrested. Most of the remaining activists were allowed to leave around 8:20 p.m.

"There were three or four hundred people on the sidewalk, perfectly within their rights to be on the sidewalk. We were illegally detained and we may bring suit against the city," said Mark Cohen of Recreate '68.

Cohen said those within the riot police line were calling family and friends on their cell phones, warning them they feared police were about to unleash tear gas."

"I don't know why else they would put on gas masks," Cohen said. "We had minors in there; we had older people in there. They were scared and I don't blame them. And there was no reason for this, no reason in the world."

"We've been peaceful the last two days," said activist Larry Hales. "[The police] are the ones who have escalated the situation."

Saunier said those arrested would be processed at the city's temporary processing facility, which was built in anticipation of mass arrests during the DNC. Protest groups upset with the jail's wire cages, dubbed the facility "Gitmo on the Platte." - Source

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Nothing could more graphically expose the political fraud of the “change you can believe in” mantra promoted by the Democrats and their presidential candidate Barack Obama than the reactionary atmosphere surrounding the party’s national convention, which kicked off Monday in Denver, Colorado.

The more than 4,000 Democratic delegates—covered by an army of some 15,000 members of the press—are convening in what amounts to a political bubble surrounded by security measures consistent with those of a police state. The convention itself, not to mention the lavish parties being thrown for the delegates—many of them elected officials—is being paid for largely by major corporations looking to buy political influence....

This is in keeping with the general tenor of the convention itself, which is packaged as a $60 million, four-day infomercial, with no question of a debate over policy breaking out on the floor of Denver’s Pepsi Center, where the delegates are assembled. The media, with very few exceptions, functions as an uncritical conduit for this process, accepting its narrow parameters as given.

It has been more than three decades since such a convention was an arena for any form of political debate, and where the outcome was not preordained. The ritualistic character of these events is a function of the widening gulf separating the official politics of the US two-party system — controlled lock, stock and barrel by the banks, corporations and a narrow financial elite — from the vast mass of the American people....

The actual scale of protest in Denver is decidedly limited. On Sunday, barely 1,200 people participated in an antiwar demonstration led by Ron Kovic, the paralyzed Vietnam War veteran and author of the book Born on the Fourth of July, and Cindy Sheehan, the mother of a soldier killed in Iraq. The leaderships of the major antiwar protest groups are part of the effort to divert anger against the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan into support for a political party that has funded and will continue both US interventions.

Nonetheless, demonstrators have been confronted with overwhelming police force. The ranks of Denver’s police have been doubled by the influx of cops from throughout the surrounding area.

As Denver’s Rocky Mountain News reported, “Hundreds of heavily armed officers, some clad in riot gear or hanging off SUVs, are saturating Denver’s streets in unprecedented numbers, quickly isolating any hint of trouble that could tarnish the city’s reputation under the limelight of the Democratic National Convention.

“The officers — on foot, horseback, bicycles and motorcycles — are armed with black batons and pepperball guns that resemble assault rifles. And they were quick to move Sunday when hundreds of rowdy protesters took to the streets of downtown.”

Police have distributed pamphlets to would-be protesters warning them that they will be subject to arrest if they refuse orders to disperse, even if they have broken no laws. To deal with potential mass arrests, the city has opened a temporary detention center — a warehouse divided into chain-link cells....

The force of 1,500 officers brought in from 52 police agencies in nearby areas does not include a huge federal contingent that has been mobilized for the event....

Some $50 million in federal funding has been allotted for security measures at each of the conventions. In Denver, a portion of this money has gone to equip police with body armor and shields as well as to purchase an armored vehicle.

Federal and local police agents have established a secret headquarters, dubbed the Multi-Agency Command Center, or MACC, from which they are monitoring every movement in the city via hundreds of security cameras that are trained on the convention center, protest sites and the entire surrounding area.

In a chilling indication that the police surveillance is far wider and more intrusive than has been reported by the media, protest leader Cindy Sheehan reported returning to her Denver hotel room Monday to find a man in her room using a screwdriver on the telephone.

The US Customs and Border Protection agency has been brought in to inspect vehicles in the city, while agents of the Transportation Security Administration are being deployed to screen those entering the convention center.

The military has also been deployed in Denver for the convention. In addition to the activation of over 1,000 National Guard troops, elements of the US Coast Guard have been placed in charge of intelligence operations in designated areas, while the North American Aerospace Defense Command and the Northern Command, based at Peterson Air Force Base in Colorado Springs, are also participating. The Pentagon refused to supply any details on the precise role of these commands, but some of the media reported that they were providing the convention with “air cover.”...

Speaking last Saturday in Springfield, Illinois, in his announcement of Delaware Senator Joseph Biden as his running mate, Obama claimed that his campaign was based on “a simple belief: that the American people were better than their government in Washington — a government that has fallen prey to special interests and policies that have left working people behind.”

Yet in Denver this week, he is presiding over a convention that is being paid for by these same special interests, with the clear understanding that their money will secure favors from Democratic politicians and, potentially, a Democratic administration headed by Obama himself....

Among the events scheduled at the convention is a poker night for delegates at Coors Field, sponsored by a business alliance that is lobbying Congress not to place restrictions on Internet gambling.

Even the government-backed mortgage finance giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac had been slated to host events and contribute to the convention’s cost, until the idea was scrapped out of fear that it would trigger outrage because of the recent government move to bail out the firms.

Behind the media glitz and meticulously staged spectacle, the Denver convention’s reality of corruption, elitism and repression is the real face of the Democratic Party and the Obama campaign. - WSWS

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[ 26 August 2008: Message edited by: M. Spector ]

[ 28 August 2008: Message edited by: M. Spector ]

The guv of Montana gave a rambling speech which tried to make the claim that the Dems are about 'energy independence' but my BS detector kept going off. Why they scheduled this guy while everyone was on pins and needles waiting for Hillary escapes me.

[ 26 August 2008: Message edited by: Boom Boom ]

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Originally posted by ceti:
Barack has this strange habit of looking from side to side rather than directly at the camera, as if he is posing for a Mount Rushmore profile.

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In only four of the last 20 presidential elections has the shorter candidate won.
Obama is 6-foot-1-inch. McCain is 5-foot-9-inches.

ETA: Hillary paid tribute to a lot of people, including Michelle Obama who spoke last night, and to Joe and Judy Biden, and to her supporters in The Sisterhood of the Travelling Pantsuits.

[ 26 August 2008: Message edited by: Boom Boom ]

2.The 'high tech' community is an increasingly important constituency for the Democratic Party (which is not to say that all of the 'high tech' workers support the Democrats) and that speech was meant as a shout out to them.

It will probably help Warner with fundraising with that community when he runs for President after the two Obama terms.

In regards to Schweitzer and his speech

I thought it was excellent. Very fiery and populist. I can understand some people not liking or trusting populism or being very skeptical of it.

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It will probably help Warner with fundraising with that community when he runs for President after the two Obama terms.

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Originally posted by Ghislaine:
I just wanted to point out the tendancy of people to refer to male politicians as "Biden, Obama" etc., but to Clinton as "Hillary". Why the double standard?

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Originally posted by Boom Boom:

We had this discussion during the primaries. Hillary's campaign material was designed this way - and last night look at all the "Hillary" placards being waved at the convention!

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You are right Boom Boom - sorry I am just sensitive to that type of thing. It seems like it is a common occurance (remember Belinda?) and serves to make women seem more juvenile than their male counterparts, who are mostly referred to by their last names. Do you think Clinton's campaign material was designed in response to this trend?

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Originally posted by Ghislaine:
In regards to Michelle Obama's positive speech, perhaps she will run against Hillary Clinton in 2012 to be nominee and it will be really interesting?

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Originally posted by Boom Boom:

Hillary Clinton has had an excellent run, but there are newer, fresher faces who probably might like a run after Obama - possibly Mark Warner, Evan Blayh, and there may be others. Michelle Obama would be an interesting choice, I agree. Imagine her running against Condi Rice in 2012 or 2016.

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I would absolutely love to see two women running against each other for president.

Are these women so tied to her that they'd willingly sell out women to a McCain presidency?

True a woman came short in becoming a nominee. But for chrissake an African American has a real shot at being the President.

As for the possibility of Hillary Clinton making a comeback in 2012 (or 2016, if Obama manages to serve two terms), it's well to remember that she is $24 million in debt, including $13 million she lent herself and presumably she would like back. Could she raise the million$ required for a second run at the presidency, especially if Mark Warner (for example) decides to enter the race as well? And, let's not forget husband Bill who has been a grumpy campaigner this time around - four years from now he'll be even maybe more crankier and more of a loose cannon, and thus a real handicap for Hillary Clinton.

I think Hillary truly deserves a prestigious post - anything she wants - in an Obama administration, if she decides to step down as guv of New York.

ETA: I used to visit my then gf in Winchester, Virginia (birthplace of Patsy Cline) while Warner was running for guverner of the state, and remember reading good stuff about him in the newspapers back then. He was born in 1954, making him five years younger than me, and I'm 59 soon. He became rich in the cell phone industry and used that money to help himself politically. He's been difficult to pin down on the Iraq war, but my sense is that he supported the war but now wants the troops home, so he may be like Obama, a potential warmonger.

[ 27 August 2008: Message edited by: Boom Boom ]

quote:

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Originally posted by Sombrero Jack:
The "Obama will invade Pakistan" rhetoric pops up frequently here on Babble. Other than Obama's initial comments of August 1, 2007, which he clarified within the same week, can anyone produce further support for this recurring claim? I'm thinking additional quotes from Obama himself or perhaps something from his policy statements?

A little Googling shows there may have been Obama comments about "taking out high-level Al Qaeda targets in the mountains of Pakistan" on July 16, 2008, but to me that doesn't sound like a full out invasion. YMMV.

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Obama, the prince of bait-and-switch

Published 24 July 2008

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Originally posted by Ghislaine:
You are right Boom Boom - sorry I am just sensitive to that type of thing. It seems like it is a common occurance (remember Belinda?) and serves to make women seem more juvenile than their male counterparts, who are mostly referred to by their last names. Do you think Clinton's campaign material was designed in response to this trend?

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Originally posted by M. Spector:
We did indeed discuss this issue during the primaries, but it was by no means conclusively resolved that calling her Hillary by default was justified simply because the Democratic Party backroom boys approved of it.

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Originally posted by Boom Boom:

I believe Hillary herself approved of this tactic - and she's the candidate, she's paying for it, and has final say.

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I think she has a right to call herself whatever she wants in her campaign branding, however if the MSM and political commentators had referred to her by her married name (or Rodham Clinton) all along, she would not have used Hillary.

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Originally posted by Ghislaine:
It also may have absolutely nothing to do with the sexism, but instead be an attempt to distance herself from the president Clinton.

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Originally posted by Boom Boom:
[QB]Unfortunately, BA, as discussed in previous threads, that African American with a shot at being President isn't a real progressive, and indeed may be a warmonger given his positions on Iran and Pakistan.

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With respect this is completely irrelevant to the historic moment of the first African American serious nominee. The same would and could be said for Clinton. That would not have overtaken the historic moment of a woman competing to be President.

Their fitness for office based on someone's criteria for fitness is not the same issue as an African American potentially becoming President just 4 decades after MLK stood and challenged his nation with a dream of a better country. It is a truly amazing bit of history and worthy of noting.

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Originally posted by Bookish Agrarian:
You are welcome to believe what you like, but I am welcome to celebrate a moment in history that seemed unlikely even a few years ago.

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[ 27 August 2008: Message edited by: Boom Boom ]

Another barnstormer speech tonight, this time from Joe Biden - he ripped McCain to shreds (which was easy to do...).

[ 27 August 2008: Message edited by: RevolutionPlease ]

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Originally posted by Boom Boom:
Biden's son (Beau) did a great job of introducing his dad.

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The content was great, lacked a bit in presentation.

Did you hear Biden's freudian slip.

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Originally posted by RevolutionPlease:
Did you hear Biden's freudian slip.

"George, er John McCain"

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[ 27 August 2008: Message edited by: RevolutionPlease ]

[ 27 August 2008: Message edited by: Boom Boom ]

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Originally posted by Ghislaine:
I just wanted to point out the tendancy of people to refer to male politicians as "Biden, Obama" etc., but to Clinton as "Hillary". Why the double standard?

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In part, because HRC branded herself that way.

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Originally posted by Boom Boom:

When will a progressive candidate do the same?

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William Jennings Bryan won the Democratic nomination. Three times. lost to the Republicans. Three times.

His Cross of Gold speech at the 1896 Democratic National Convention - said to have won him the nomination - is a classic of progressive political rhetoric of that time.

The text can be read here. It includes the following para which should appeal to babblers:

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Mr. Carlisle said in 1878 that this was a struggle between the idle holders of idle capital and the struggling masses who produce the wealth and pay the taxes of the country; and my friends, it is simply a question that we shall decide upon which side shall the Democratic Party fight. Upon the side of the idle holders of idle capital, or upon the side of the struggling masses? That is the question that the party must answer first; and then it must be answered by each individual hereafter. The sympathies of the Democratic Party, as described by the platform, are on the side of the struggling masses, who have ever been the foundation of the Democratic Party.

. . .

Having behind us the commercial interests and the laboring interests and all the toiling masses, we shall answer their demands for a gold standard by saying to them, you shall not press down upon the brow of labor this crown of thorns. You shall not crucify mankind upon a cross of gold.

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His subsequent role in the Scopes Monkey Trial will seem bizarre to modern progressives, but seen in the context of Bryan's opposition to Social Darwinism, it makes more sense.

[ 27 August 2008: Message edited by: Malcolm French, APR ]

excerpt:

Sometimes John McCain's campaign gets jealous of the attention given to Barack Obama. And the McCain camp hasn't hesitated to try to grab the spotlight and rain on Obama's parade, even at the risk of looking petty. So even though it would be a major break with the unwritten rules of politics, it's not too surprising to hear that some McCain advisors are at least considering the idea of announcing the Arizona senator's running mate on Thursday night, the same night that Obama will be giving his big speech officially accepting the Democratic presidential nomination.

Suggested Toga Styles:

The Nobleman -- This toga is recommended for men. For celebrities and lobbyists, please add the red over toga. One should expect to see such stars as Ben Affleck dress in red robes, along with the lobbyists who fill Invesco Field's skyboxes.

excerpt:

excerpt:

Today, workers at Invesco Field are putting the final touches on the newest wonder of the modern political world -- The Temple of Obama (“The Barackopolis”). It is upon this pulpit that Barack Obama will tomorrow night address thousands of screaming, adoring fans.

excerpt:

ETA: (from that Daily Mail link) Once Obama speaks, confetti will rain down on him and fireworks will be fired from around the stadium wall.

ETA: isn't it odd that no one in the DNC planning committee realized this structure would be attacked in the way it has ("Barackopolis")? Or did they just forge ahead?

[ 28 August 2008: Message edited by: Boom Boom ]

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Originally posted by Boom Boom:

Barack Obama's big speech tonight will be delivered from an elaborate columned platform resembling a miniature Greek temple, it has been revealed.

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Originally posted by Bookish Agrarian:
Oh for Christ's sake. Today is the aniversery of MLK's speech from the steps of the Lincoln memorial.

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Originally posted by M. Spector:
If they are trying to say Obama is the Second Coming of MLK, they've got a lot of chutzpah!

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Actually, they are not saying that. They are saying Obama is the Second Coming of Christ himself.

ETA: Either that or the odds-on-favorite for the upcoming season of American Idol.

[ 28 August 2008: Message edited by: Sven ]

[ 28 August 2008: Message edited by: Papal Bull ]

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Originally posted by M. Spector:
If they are trying to say Obama is the Second Coming of MLK, they've got a lot of chutzpah!

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I have no idea what they are trying to say. Maybe they just got the stage props cheap from Pillars R Us.

However, whether you like Obama or not this is a historic moment in the history of the United States. On a day when a historic moment took place over 40 years ago, on the aniversary of a day that was part of trying to entrench voting rights for African Americans an African American will be making a speech as he becomes the nominee for President. Anyway that is historic any illusion to this aniversary is entirely appropriate whatever your feelings about Obama and whether he is pure enough to be the nominee.

[ 28 August 2008: Message edited by: Bookish Agrarian ]

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Originally posted by Bookish Agrarian:
However, whether you like Obama or not this is a historic moment in the history of the United States.

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Yes, that's absolutely true. And the Republicans know this, and they're doing everything possible (it seems) to derail the event. If McCain does the absolutely unthinkable tonight and unveil his VP choice on Obama's big day, I can't see how McCain could show his face in public again, or anyone ever taking him seriously again - doing such a thing would show incredibly bad judgement. So, will he, or won't he?

ETA: Nope, McCain's announcement is still set for Friday.

[ 28 August 2008: Message edited by: Boom Boom ]

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Originally posted by Bookish Agrarian:
Anyway that is historic any illusion to this aniversary is entirely appropriate whatever your feelings about Obama and whether he is pure enough to be the nominee.

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I'm 100% sure Obama will make a big deal about the anniversary in his speech. Is that not enough of an allusion to MLK? Do they have to bring in a Hollywood recreation of the Lincoln Memorial just to drive the point home?

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Isn't it obvious that Obama is shamelessly trying to cash in on respect for MLK and his struggles, while suggesting that MLK would approve of Obama's crass political opportunism?

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Whether you want to admit it or not this is a historic moment for America. One that should be celebrated and respected. Tomorrow will be soon enough to return to sniping.

Having done scholarly work in relation to MLK he was not above a little crass political opportunism, yet he still remains one of my personal heroes if that is the right word.

quote:

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Originally posted by Bookish Agrarian:
spelling flames are childish

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Whether you want to admit it or not this is a historic moment for America. One that should be celebrated and respected. Tomorrow will be soon enough to return to sniping.

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Layton will be attending the convention for three days.

"Democrats here are talking about the same kind of change we’re talking about in Canada," said Layton. "Whether it’s real action on climate change, forging trade policies that work for working families or standing up for jobs and better health care, there’s a real desire here to put the concerns of the kitchen table ahead of the boardroom table."

Layton will also be attending the National Democratic Institute’s International Leaders Forum while in Denver and will be speaking to the Labour Caucus of the Democratic Party.

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Originally posted by Webgear:
Maybe they have the same policy for Afghanistan.

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Originally posted by bagkitty:
At the risk of causing topic drift... Will Obama manage to say the "gay" word? Ted Kennedy and Hillary Clinton managed to work it in, Bill Clinton and Joe Biden didn't. Any wagers?

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Originally posted by Boom Boom:
Something is happening. The DNC estimated they would get a crowd of 76,000 tonight; CNN just said the number is between 80,000 - 85,000, and is growing by the minute. CNN just called this the largest gathering in American political history. Holy cow!

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Originally posted by Doug:
There's apparently a large crowd watching in Times Square too.

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Originally posted by RevolutionPlease:
Wasn't there a million-man march?

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Originally posted by RevolutionPlease:
Wasn't there a million-man march?

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Originally posted by remind:

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quote:

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Originally posted by Webgear:

Well, I guess someone of your intellectual level would find that image is funny and a suitable reply.

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Here is a

quote:

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Originally posted by RevolutionPlease:
"Government cannot solve all our problems." Barack Obama, 2008.

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Originally posted by M. Spector:
posted 28 August 2008 12:11 PM

I wasn't "flaming". I was pointing out a Freudian slip. What's childish is being unable to recognize the difference.

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I know you are one of those that think everything is about you, but if you want to read back it is clear I am responding to more than one person.

We must develop and maintain the capacity to forgive. He who is devoid of the power to forgive is devoid of the power to love. There is some good in the worst of us and some evil in the best of us. When we discover this, we are less prone to hate our enemies.
Martin Luther King, Jr.

Sorry I do not feel annoyed or humiliated.

However I do feel sorry for you. You are so filled with hatred, I see it in every post you make.