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Author Topic: Resisting threats to artistic and intelectual expression
libertarian
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6136

posted 04 October 2006 07:55 AM      Profile for libertarian        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
More threats from religous zealots:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,13509-2385684,00.html

This is getting scary. Fear will soon trump art and other intellectual pursuits.


From: Chicago | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
kropotkin1951
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2732

posted 04 October 2006 01:40 PM      Profile for kropotkin1951   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
His remarks sound like hate speech to me. If you inserted the Torah or Bible into his diatribe instead of the Koran then maybe it would be clearer to a Western mind.

The BC Human Rights Code includes prohibitions on publications that are: "likely to expose a person or a group of persons to hatred or contempt because of ... religion.

quote:
He called the Prophet “a merciless warlord, a looter, a mass murderer of Jews and a polygamist”. The Koran, he said, was a book of incredible violence.
That appears on its face to be likely to expose Moslems to hatred and almost certainly to contempt. Yes if you are a Moslem in a western country fear of the majority holding you in contempt is a real fear. France is interesting because it has this so called respect for rights but has banned all religious symbols. No Sikh turbans in that countries schools. It seems banning religious expression is alright but not banning hate speech directed at a specific religious minority.

From: North of Manifest Destiny | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged
ghlobe
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 12731

posted 04 October 2006 02:04 PM      Profile for ghlobe        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by kropotkin1951:
His remarks sound like hate speech to me. If you inserted the Torah or Bible into his diatribe instead of the Koran then maybe it would be clearer to a Western mind.

The BC Human Rights Code includes prohibitions on publications that are: "likely to expose a person or a group of persons to hatred or contempt because of ... religion.
That appears on its face to be likely to expose Moslems to hatred and almost certainly to contempt. Yes if you are a Moslem in a western country fear of the majority holding you in contempt is a real fear. France is interesting because it has this so called respect for rights but has banned all religious symbols. No Sikh turbans in that countries schools. It seems banning religious expression is alright but not banning hate speech directed at a specific religious minority.


What's next? Now you can't criticize a religion or a historical figure?

Remember not to say anything bad about Henry VIII. It would expose Angelicans to hatred. Nothing bad about any of the Popes either. Catholics would be exposed to hatred.

These hate speech laws are ridiculous.

[ 04 October 2006: Message edited by: ghlobe ]


From: Ottawa | Registered: Jun 2006  |  IP: Logged
jeff house
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 518

posted 04 October 2006 02:23 PM      Profile for jeff house     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
He called the Prophet “a merciless warlord, a looter, a mass murderer of Jews and a polygamist”
writing in Le Figaro, a major newspaper in France.


I guess he never dreamed that anyone would take umbrage at this.

Threats are nasty, but they are common when people write or say offensive things. When I have been quoted by US Commentator Bill O'Reilly insulting President Bush as a war criminal, my email in-box fills up with death threats.

In a polarized situation, threats are made. Let's hope no one acts them out.


From: toronto | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
libertarian
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6136

posted 04 October 2006 02:34 PM      Profile for libertarian        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Yes Kropotkin, but what if his remarks, from an historical perspective, are true?
I once read a book called the Passover Plot indicating that Jesus arranged his own crucifiction. It was purely an historical treatise. No one got upset and threatened death to the author.

I think that intellectuals and artists have a right to publish whatever they wish as long as they do not urge others to kill.


From: Chicago | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
bigcitygal
Volunteer Moderator
Babbler # 8938

posted 04 October 2006 04:57 PM      Profile for bigcitygal     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by libertarian:
I think that intellectuals and artists have a right to publish whatever they wish as long as they do not urge others to kill.

Okay libertarian, I'll bite but I need to be clear that I find the libertarian party line very boring.

Yes, intellectuals and artists have a right to publish what they like. However, with that right comes the responsibility to the integrity of the work that they've written/produced, such as defending claims if they are outlandish, outright lies, or hateful.

Seems like your buddy in France wanted the right to shoot off his asshat racist mouth with impunity. Sorry, doesn't work that way. I'm not defending death threats, but c'mon! Calling Islam "nyah nyah"-level bad names, from the secure Western position of intellectual "superiority"? If he wanted a media frenzy he got his wish.

quote:

But one of Mr Boubakeur’s advisors told the Financial Times that Mr Redeker had a reputation for being “ideologically committed” to the theory of a clash of civilisations between Islam and the west.

Link here to Financial Times


From: It's difficult to work in a group when you're omnipotent - Q | Registered: Apr 2005  |  IP: Logged
marzo
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Babbler # 12096

posted 04 October 2006 05:40 PM      Profile for marzo     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
No matter how annoying this man's opinions are, it's not worth getting violent and threatening murder. The trouble with this situation is that it further entrenches a popular image of Muslims as violent, unreasonable fanatics. I'd like to see more of a Muslim movement for peace and humanitarian values, if that's possible.
From: toronto | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged

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