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Author Topic: beware Europe's health-care model
Cougyr
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posted 26 December 2005 02:56 PM      Profile for Cougyr     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
There's an interesting Star article on the problems governments have regulating public/private health care.

quote:
What is now emerging, however, is that the health-reform boat in Europe may not have been headed in the right direction.

The complex and often Byzantine arrangements of mixed systems have proven to be administrative nightmares with serious consequences to both the rising cost of health care and, more important for many people, the cost in equity and social solidarity.



From: over the mountain | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
Cougyr
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posted 29 December 2005 04:14 PM      Profile for Cougyr     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
bump.
From: over the mountain | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
simonvallee
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posted 29 December 2005 04:27 PM      Profile for simonvallee   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
What the hell is this thread doing in "labor and consumption"? Shouldn't it be in the "politics" forum?
From: Boucherville, Québec | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
Cougyr
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Babbler # 3336

posted 29 December 2005 08:13 PM      Profile for Cougyr     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by simonvallee:
What the hell is this thread doing in "labor and consumption"? Shouldn't it be in the "politics" forum?

Maybe. Feel free to move it there. Frankly, I think almost every post should be in Politics.

Regardless, I think this article is worth reading. As usual, Canada seems about to jump on another bandwagon that has already lost its lustre.


From: over the mountain | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
Clog-boy
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posted 29 December 2005 08:36 PM      Profile for Clog-boy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I had written a lengthy addition to this article the other day, about the situation for the Netherlands. Had taken me from about 3am till 4am to compose it. Then I wanted to add something from my g-mail account, so I opened it through a shortcut. But the shortcut opened in the 1st explorer window available, which was...? Exactly, my babble reply-window...! I tried to stop the load, but was too late, the g-mail screen popped up. Frantic, I clicked "previous page", but it showed an empty reply-box...
Don't think many of the neighbours in my apartment building slept through that event... Still can't believe I didn't throw anything against the wall or have broken my keyboard with my forehead, just a plain, old-fashioned, howling scream from the gut...
So here goes take#2:

We here in the Netherlands face a new Health Care System (HCS) starting 2006. Basically, it comes down to the same (or even less) care and double the pay. Lots of problems have been predicted, many doctors and dentists fear the worst.
This new HCS has been set in motion in order to create a liberalisation of the heatlth insurance market. A nice, little side-effect is that the insurers charged 800mln euro (1,1bln CAD) too many to us Dutch, which comes down to 50 euro (bout 70 CAD) per capita. They charged this only for the purpose of advertising for the new health care system (and themselves in the meantime, of course!)
Another big issue is the concern (living amongst citizens and doctors/dentists) that insurers will have a say in the treatment. For example, if you face a treament, which can be performed cheaper in a hospital across the country, you'd better start packing your bags...
Due to this concern, a lot of dentists refused to sign a contract with their insurers. People with certain insurance policies can face paying their own bills when going to the dentist...!

Another debate that has been started, is about the "no claim refund". This refund is a part of the new HCS, in order to ease the doubling in insurance premium. A nice gesture it seems, but people with a chronic illness or weaker health will suffer from this. They won't receive the refund and will be set back financially (even more, since I don't really know anybody who really improved financially from an illness) This debate is still running, no clear signals are given by our government. Guess they overlooked this little side-effect of the refund, eh?


Most of the opposition parties have stated that they will drastically alter the new HCS, if they seize power in the election in 2007. Some of them even went as far as saying they'd turn back all the changes and go back to the our current HCS (although a lotta experts say there won't be a way back after changing to the new HCS).

It's a weird situation: Our goverment, our insurers and our medical world are caught in a rumble on the ground, a wrestling match. And us Dutch are standing at the side-lines, not gaining much confidence in either of the three parties...
I hold my breath for what other concoctions our government has in store for us...

[ETA: Yeehaw, didn't delete it this time...!]

[ 29 December 2005: Message edited by: Clog-boy ]


From: Arnhem, The Netherlands | Registered: Nov 2005  |  IP: Logged
a lonely worker
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posted 29 December 2005 07:52 PM      Profile for a lonely worker     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Thanks Clogboy for posting this. I'm glad your post finally made it through.

When our Supreme Court gave their baffling ruling this summer, the news was filled with neo-cons and neo-libs jumping for joy saying that we should follow European and Australian two tiered models.

We had some friends from Australia visiting us when this happened. They sat totally horrified at the distortions of their system and said that many Australians would love our medicare system, where need takes precendence over greed. They still use the public side of things and their waiting times are pathetic. The problem with the right wing spin we're getting here is that they only look at "average" wait times in these two tiered countries leading to the following situations of two rich people having same day service and one poor person waiting forever for the public one. Of course the "average" looks better but tell that to the person who can't pay to go to the front of the queue.

I really wish more people would have a chance to see and read some of these experiences from other countries. Let's hope none of us ever see this happen here because as you said once our health care is privatised it's very hard to go back.


From: Anywhere that annoys neo-lib tools | Registered: Jul 2005  |  IP: Logged
Geneva
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posted 30 December 2005 01:27 AM      Profile for Geneva     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
speaking of other countries, I live in France, recently ranked No. 1 in the world by the WHO for its general health care levels

some counter-intuitive facts:

- money is everywhere, cash or Visa; you pay cash at the doctor every visit (current rate, 22 euros, cash or cheque) and most specialists have Visa card machines;
this is partially reimbursed, but entire Canadian elections have turned on this issue -- no user-fees! It seems to work fairly well here;

- private clinics, specialty medical units, etc are also everywhere, and not an issue for the general voter, and waiting lists not a problem either, although there is less freedom for elective surgery.

Given this, I have no problem with a mixed public/private health system.

[ 30 December 2005: Message edited by: Geneva ]


From: um, well | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged

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