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Author Topic: US military in South America
Cougyr
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posted 18 February 2006 10:49 PM      Profile for Cougyr     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
US Southern Command

There are American troops in much of South America. Is this ominous? Are the Americans up to something? There were rumours about a prison camp in Paraguay. Does anybody know anything?

Attention: Rici Lake


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Winston Smith
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posted 18 February 2006 10:54 PM      Profile for Winston Smith        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Achtung Baby!
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Fidel
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posted 18 February 2006 11:26 PM      Profile for Fidel     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I think several of those nations are still used as bases by the same U.S. intel groups that were key to CIA/NSA operation "condor." Hundreds of thousands of S. American's were interred in concentration-like camps while many thousands of leftists were murdered and "disappeared" in the 1970's and 80's.
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rici
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posted 18 February 2006 11:33 PM      Profile for rici     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The US is always up to something

For example, this is from the 2007 International Affairs budget request: (emphasis mine)

quote:
South America (Bolivia, Ecuador, Paraguay, Peru, Venezuela): $19.5 million to consolidate democratic gains and to address deep-seated economic and social problems in the Andean region and in Paraguay. In Venezuela, and as needed in Bolivia, U.S. funds will support efforts to protect and strengthen civil society, independent media, human rights organizations and democratic political parties. Funds will be used to reform the justice sector, strengthen democratic institutions, promote the rule of law, and make sub-national government practices more effective through improved transparency and accountability. Additionally, funding will facilitate expansion and implementation of free trade agreements, and will be used to fight corruption and promote respect for human rights.

Here's the whole thing. (Try searching for Colombia, and note how much of this budget is aimed at the drug trade. I may post on this some other time.)

I presume that this report is what you're talking about with respect to Paraguay. I don't know much more about it, I'm afraid. (But there's a lot of interesting reading there.)

Here's my worry: more and more, I'm hearing anti-democratic rumblings from neocons, and the old Venezuela-as-part-of-the-Axis-of-Evil meme is starting to show up again. These are probably linked; in other words, since there is no credible argument any more that Chávez is not legitimately elected, the next move is to deny the value of legitimate elections. And Chávez's belligerence makes him a convenient publicity target. I can only hope that Chávez really knows what he is doing.

Even if it is just posturing on both sides, though, it has a chilling effect on democracy in the rest of South America. For example, it is a constraint on Evo Morales. Evo is not a good scarecrow; he's too smart, too diplomatic, and too genuine; you really cannot help liking and respecting him. So it's very convenient to link him to Hugo Chávez; US spin strategy seems to be to never mention Bolivia without suddenly dragging Chávez into the equation; aside from the occasional snide "populist coca-chewer" remarks, the idea seems to be to avoid getting him in the news.

These people are not stupid. They're really good games-players, and they start with most of the deck. And they think of it as a game, too, even if their public posture is that it is a moral crusade. I don't think we get anywhere by falling into the moral crusade trap and setting up our own; that road just leads to confrontation, and they will win any confrontation, eventually. That's just my opinion, and it probably doesn't matter much to anyone. But for what its worth, there it is.


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eau
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posted 19 February 2006 12:05 AM      Profile for eau        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Pesky peasants getting uppity...can't have that can we..

Morales and Chavez speak for the indigenous of their respective countries. The non aligned countries need to find a voice in our world. It's been a while and after what has been inflicted upon Latin America by vested interests for the past few centuries, I am delighted this is happening and take every chance I get to say so.


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Cougyr
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posted 19 February 2006 03:03 AM      Profile for Cougyr     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Rici Lake:
I presume that this report is what you're talking about with respect to Paraguay. I don't know much more about it, I'm afraid. (But there's a lot of interesting reading there.)

Yes. My problem is that almost everything I read on the subject seems to originate with Benjamin Dangl. There is very little else. Maybe there is, but not translated.

Thanks, Rici. If you see reports that we ought to know about, please let us know.


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M. Spector
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posted 19 February 2006 03:50 AM      Profile for M. Spector   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
U.S. State Department denies the Paraguay story:
quote:
The United States does not have a military base in Paraguay and has no plans to establish one. The United States has not asked the Paraguayan government for a military base, nor does it intend to station soldiers in Paraguay. As explained below, limited, short-term deployments of U.S. military personnel are scheduled to take place for a series of joint exercises with the Paraguayan military between July 2005 and December 2006. Most personnel deployed will not remain in Paraguay for more than 45 days.

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Cougyr
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posted 19 February 2006 12:48 PM      Profile for Cougyr     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
For the 2005-2006 series of exercises, small numbers of U.S. personnel – generally 10-20 persons at a time – will train with their Paraguayan counterparts for periods of two to six weeks. No U.S. soldiers will be deployed for an extended period of time, and there will never be more than a few dozen U.S. service members in Paraguay for longer than 45 days.

You can't imagine how often I saw and heard comments like that during the early Vietnam years. While that State Department report might be correct, they have lied so frequently that they can't be considered credible.


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nycndp
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posted 19 February 2006 12:53 PM      Profile for nycndp     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cougyr:

You can't imagine how often I saw and heard comments like that during the early Vietnam years. While that State Department report might be correct, they have lied so frequently that they can't be considered credible.


And do America's enemies broadcast in advance their military and intelligence moves?


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Cueball
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posted 19 February 2006 12:59 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
How would that be possible? In most cases they don't even have the time to discover that they have moved from the friends list to the enemies list, let alone time to concoct a massive disinfromation campaign.
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rici
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posted 19 February 2006 01:29 PM      Profile for rici     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
How would that be possible? In most cases they don't even have the time to discover that they have moved from the friends list to the enemies list, let alone time to concoct a massive disinfromation campaign.

Apparently they are developing a Rapid Reaction Spin Force (see link in my comment #7).


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Cueball
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posted 19 February 2006 01:34 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I just remember how astonished Tariq Aziz looked when the charges of chemical attacks against the Kurds were made against the Iraqi regieme during the 1990 Gulf War. The CIA guys working the case in 80's had actively prmoted the idea that Halabja was done by the Iranians, and this had been the status quo assumption promoted by the War College on Capitol Hill for 5 year.

Yet, when the chips were down, the Whitehouse simply brought out new experts and history was rewritten in a period of months.


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Cougyr
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posted 19 February 2006 03:10 PM      Profile for Cougyr     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The denial of the Paraguay base, just brings up lots of questions. Was the American military just checking it out for possible future use? Are the Paraguayans acting as proxies in some way? Are suspected terrorists being held there? (that was rumoured) Does the US envision this in any dispute with Bolivia, should the latter interfere with American corporate interests in the gas fields? This list can get long. Of course, it might have been a good will tour, mightn't it?
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