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Author Topic: Venezuela's Chavez Calls CAFTA 'Perverse'
Cueball
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posted 01 August 2005 08:44 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Venezuela's Chavez Calls CAFTA 'Perverse'

This guy kills me:

quote:
Chavez, a frequent critic of the U.S. government, also said he had read reports of President Bush "putting money in circulation to buy votes and to blackmail, through the so-called (U.S.) intelligence agencies, to approve an initiative which is perverse."



From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
ephemeral
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posted 01 August 2005 12:49 PM      Profile for ephemeral     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
thanks for the link, cueball. i hope chavez sets an example to other governments world-wide, that treaties like CAFTA, NAFTA, GATT, etc. can only be the downfall of any developing nation's economy, and the ruin of every country's ecological habitats.
From: under a bridge with a laptop | Registered: Apr 2005  |  IP: Logged
Stargazer
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posted 01 August 2005 01:18 PM      Profile for Stargazer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I love Chavez and hope he doesn't get assassinated due to his pro South America approach. It's admirable the way he his stood up to Bush and the freaks in the Whitehouse.
From: Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist. | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
fern hill
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posted 01 August 2005 02:22 PM      Profile for fern hill        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Uh-oh. The Catholic Church has weighed in, according to Voice of America. A cardinal is calling Chavez a 'paranoid dictator'.

edited to fix link:
web page

[ 01 August 2005: Message edited by: fern hill ]


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Stargazer
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posted 01 August 2005 03:03 PM      Profile for Stargazer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
No surprise there. Now why would a good Christian organization support the rights of workers to maintain control over their own products? Naw, not the Catholic church!
From: Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist. | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
M. Spector
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posted 02 August 2005 02:05 AM      Profile for M. Spector   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The VOA article says:
quote:
A vast majority of Venezuelans are Catholic, and Cardinal Castillo says the church enjoys greater credibility than the government.

Apparently in terms of popularity, at least, the Church does indeed have the edge. Chavez has a "mere" 71.8% approval rating:

quote:
The most popular institutions in the country are the Catholic Church (78.7% approval), followed by the banks (75.2%), the mass media (75%), and Chavez (71.8%). Leon speculated that the reason the banks faired [sic] so well in this survey, compared to the general disgust that has often been shown towards them because of exorbitantly high interest rates, is that interest rates have come down significantly recently, but especially for home loans, largely as a result of government regulation.
[snip]
Finally, in terms of ideological self-definition, the poll states that 26.4% of Venezuelans support socialism, 15.5% support capitalism, 7.8% support neither type of system, and the rest (49.5%) did not answer or were undecided. Source

From: One millihelen: The amount of beauty required to launch one ship. | Registered: Feb 2005  |  IP: Logged
M. Spector
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posted 02 August 2005 02:15 AM      Profile for M. Spector   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
CAFTA has Nicaragua's small farmers worried as well:

quote:
Half of all Nicaraguans live on farms; most of them, like Augusto, are small farmers growing basic grains and a few vegetables on a couple acres of land. Under CAFTA, Nicaragua would drop its tariffs on most products, leading to an influx of cheap wheat and cheap corn from the U.S., and a dramatic drop in prices. The National Association of Ranchers and Farmers (UNAG) estimates that as many as 170,000 farms could be driven out of business by the agreement, with a loss of 420,000 jobs. The Nicaraguan government counters that the agreement will bring more textile factories to Nicaragua, but the government's most optimistic estimates promise only 70,000 new jobs, and small farmers are reluctant to give up their way of life for a marginal existence in the city. Source

From: One millihelen: The amount of beauty required to launch one ship. | Registered: Feb 2005  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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posted 02 August 2005 03:31 AM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
.. and worse for the Nicaraguans (sorry for the thread drift), the USA can undercut their production costs because of the large agribiz companies taking advantage of farm subsidies and economies of scale.

Hugo Chavez, ~71% approval rating? Impressive. I freely admit I was one of those who was ready to write off his presidency in 2003 when the recall went through and the voting kicked off. But that man has nine political lives, it seems, and came back ready to roll.

'Course, to hear the mainstream media tell it, Chavez is ready to become Castro Junior.


From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Hawkins
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posted 02 August 2005 11:35 AM      Profile for Hawkins     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
And those 200 Doctors make headline news on the BBC... "The Cubans are coming to treat the poor and offer affordable survices. That is against our right to make exorbitant money off the rich, who now complain at our offices that the slums are getting treatment. They are worried that they soon will have nothing to show for their years of raping and pillaging the country! Give us our rights!"

The real big scary thing of CAFTA is the medical drug costs which will sky rocket in centroam. They are bringing drug costs into line with US prices... they already are past the limits of many poor.

There are also anti union provisions.

And its also going to hit small farmers extremely bad.


From: Burlington Ont | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
Fidel
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posted 02 August 2005 11:48 AM      Profile for Fidel     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Fidel and Hugo are planning to educate and train thousands of Venezuelan physicians under the Bolivarian Alternative trade pact. Unless Washington decides on a redo of the 70's and 80's when hospitals and schools were bombed by contras and paid mercenaries/terrorists from around the world, the Latin American revolution marches on.

Viva la revolucion!


From: Viva La Revolución | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
Betray My Secrets
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posted 02 August 2005 12:07 PM      Profile for Betray My Secrets     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Sadly, Smiling Jack has more respect for Bev the Bigot and the Drug Gestapo than for a true hero.
From: Guyana | Registered: Jul 2005  |  IP: Logged
jeff house
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posted 02 August 2005 12:11 PM      Profile for jeff house     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Interestingly, Krugman says that CAFTA was passed because it includes provisions restricting Chinese imports to the US:

quote:
Cafta contains "free trade" in its title, but that's misleading. The administration rammed the bill through the House by, among other things, promising to limit imports of clothing from China; over all, the effect may well be to reduce, not increase, international trade.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/01/opinion/01krugman.html?incamp=article_popular


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Hawkins
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posted 02 August 2005 12:39 PM      Profile for Hawkins     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Understandable as the centroam countries were promised clothing manufacturers... and that industry would have to come from somewhere. If there is a loop hole in the whole system to just shut down all import trade I wouldn't be surprised.
From: Burlington Ont | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
jeff house
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posted 02 August 2005 01:09 PM      Profile for jeff house     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Understandable as the centroam countries were promised clothing manufacturers... and that industry would have to come from somewhere.

Oh, I thought the whole theory of free trade was that no one could promise anyone anything.

Instead, the enervating effect of pure competition, the ability to become "more efficient" than the competition, was what created and maintained industry under free trade.

So now you're telling me that it all depends upon political favoritism?


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Hawkins
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posted 02 August 2005 02:01 PM      Profile for Hawkins     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
From what I read about CAFTA after the Guatemalan protest deaths - the way it was sold to centroam countries would be the increase in clothing manufacturing to create new jobs (mentioned above I think). Something that makes the elites in these countries jump for joy since they get to own/be managers of these factories. The problem is two fold for the poor: one it also comes with the removal of protection for local farmers and they will lose their jobs because of an inability to provide. When they go to these new factories, as someone said there wont be many factories. And since the farms will then be bought up by big companies (if they haven't been already) for more cash crops it will be very hard for the once farmers to be self sufficient in any way.

And the benefits are two fold it seems for elites: they get extremely cheap labour for their factories (more workers than work will drive wages down further) and they will get better access to the farmlands for cash crops (if they didn't have enough already!). With the competitive advantage of being closer to the US market than China I can see why they are salivating over this "deal".

Though I guess someone may argue "but its good that there will be cheaper food for the poor people!"

edited to add: I sorta got and sorta didn't get the sarcastic nature of your post jeff - my mind is going very very slow today!

[ 02 August 2005: Message edited by: Hawkins ]


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Albion1
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posted 03 August 2005 08:44 PM      Profile for Albion1     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Venezuela has a media that is all anti-Chavez and the US calls Venezuela a dictatorship!

The US has a media that is all pro-Bush and the Americans call this a democracy!!


From: Toronto, ON. Canada | Registered: Jun 2005  |  IP: Logged

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