babble home
rabble.ca - news for the rest of us
today's active topics


Post New Topic  Post A Reply
FAQ | Forum Home
  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» babble   » walking the talk   » labour and consumption   » shoplifting

Email this thread to someone!    
Author Topic: shoplifting
Trespasser
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 1204

posted 22 August 2002 07:50 PM      Profile for Trespasser   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
So I decide today to go to the Wal-Mart for the first time in my life and buy an electronic gadget. (Did you know that they had tiny shop carts for children with a flag that says "Future Wal-Mart customer in training?" I swear!) After I paid I picked my two bags and headed towards the doors. I expected them to open automatically, but they didn't. When I tried to push, the beep of the alarm system for detecting shoplifted items went off. What the...? A sales-associate-slash-security guy materialized beside me in a flash, and in a low, 'professional' voice started the spiel that I assume they start with anybody suspected of shoplifting: "Ma'm, may I see your bags..." He took away the big bag and I was left hanging out by the door pretending to read one of their brochures. Here he comes three minutes later carrying the same bag, and asks me to show him my receipt. I remember I almost tossed the receipt away, but I eventually found it. He studied the wrinkled receipt for what looked like minutes. He finally let go off me, with a smile and "Have a good day" of course.

OK, so this wasn't a story about *real* shoplifting, but it did remind me of some earlier shop mischiefs that involved first person singular. When I was an undergrad student, I once actually managed to shoplift a book from a bookstore (it was a polisci journal, nothing canonical), and the second time I tried (it was a textbook on rhetorics that I needed for an exam) I didn't bother taking all the precautions and the alarm by the door went off. But get this: after I returned the book to the front desk, I stayed on and rummaged through some other books on display that interested me. No idea how I managed to do that.

Actually, this may be part of the explanation: in my first country, somebody caught shoplifting food or a book is never prosecuted. If caught, the good is returned to the owner and that's that. Stealing food is a desperate act and if somebody really needed some food so much and could not afford it through any other way but shoplifting, that's almost OK. As far as stealing a book goes, there's a tacit agreement that 'students will be students'.

Now I have a question. Why the supermarkets prosecute minor shoplifters? I know that some friends of friends here in Canada have gone to court for putting a can of tuna in the pocket, and I still have difficulty believing that the supermarkets bothered to do it - or were nasty enough to do it.


From: maritimes | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 490

posted 22 August 2002 08:50 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The one time I walked out with something it was completely unintentional. I had a table of derivatives from the bookstore under my arm as I was walking around, browsing. I walked out, completely forgetting that I was going to buy the thing. I went to my residence on campus and only then discovered I had had it under my arm with some of my other books.
From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
lagatta
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2534

posted 22 August 2002 09:11 PM      Profile for lagatta     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Hmm, many years ago I was dragged through the courts about such an absent-minded "theft". I was writing my thesis at the time. At a pharmacy, they were giving out samples of toothpaste or something, so of course I took one and stuck it in my pocket, with a tiny "ampoule" of stuff for split ends (I have thick, very curly hair so I consume a fair bit of hair gunk).
-
I was lucky to get a first-rate lawyer who accepted to take my case legal aid through a refugee-case lawyer I've worked with. Eventually I got off, (I refused to plead "guilty" and ask for a discharge as it was an honest mistake. Moreover, I had been arrested for political and trade-union stuff - of which I am not in the least ashamed, so an unconditional discharge would have been tough). But the whole thing was a comedy of absurdity for a $2 product.
-
Turns out the pharmacy chain (Jean Coutu) had recently prosecuted a poor bugger who had stolen La Presse...
-
Going through Municipal Court, you see a lot of sad stories. Mentally ill people arrested for peeing in the street, desperately poor people who had stolen the proverbial tin of tuna, people smoking everywhere despite the no smoking signs. The court officials thought I was a lawyer as I looked "respectable" and was carrying a briefcase.
-
My lawyer said that in some other countries, pilferage was a "summary offence" and those caught had to pay a fine, without a record. This precludes endless court battles to prevent getting a criminal record, while reassuring shopkeepers who had a legitimate fear about the damage shoplifters could do to their business (I'm not concerned about big firms, but I know people who owned a bookshop that went under in part due to such "shrinkage")... Deliberately shoplifting is NOT cool.
-
My thesis adivser later had a laugh about the whole thing, realising how absent-minded I was, as my brain was somewhere in the great Italian strike wave of "il biennio rosso"... And a very respectable old friend of mine showed me a hinge that he (he is over 80) had pocketed without payment purely by accident.

From: Se non ora, quando? | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Trespasser
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 1204

posted 22 August 2002 09:44 PM      Profile for Trespasser   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Generally, I don't have anything against deliberate (petty, desperate) shoplifting in big and medium size businesses. The Winona Rider type of shoplifting, OTOH, is another story.
From: maritimes | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
lagatta
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2534

posted 22 August 2002 09:51 PM      Profile for lagatta     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I've got nothing against such acts of desperation either, Trespasser, except that I don't really think poor people can usually win at that game.
From: Se non ora, quando? | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Trespasser
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 1204

posted 22 August 2002 10:13 PM      Profile for Trespasser   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
You're probably right. That's why I am for the fee system that you mentioned, and no criminal record. Anything else is absurd.

I remember reading in a book about the beginnings of the Second Feminist Wave (I think it was A Feminist Memoir Project by Snitow and DuPlessis) a personal history of a feminist activist of that time. One day she would go to an Ivy League University to give a lecture to a roomful of sophisticated well-off young women eager to learn more about feminism, and the next day she would join a low-income single mothers' anti-poverty group that went on a raid of a chain department store in search of winter clothes for their kids... It's a chilling read. She says she was lucky to be able to be active in both environments, and that both types of activism are equally important. She also mentions, however, that she felt more comfortable in the latter.

On some days, I feel the same. As if some immediate mini-violent action with people who share my story is the only way out of exasperation. It eventually dawns on me that such actions wind up costing the most people who undertook them.


From: maritimes | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
Timebandit
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 1448

posted 23 August 2002 01:30 PM      Profile for Timebandit     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Being absent-minded in general, I have walked out with something from time to time... But I always go back and pay for it. I get really strange looks when I do, but nobody has ever threatened to prosecute, not even when they've caught me on the way out.

Maybe I look clueless enough that they believe me...

Even as a kid, I never intentionally shoplifted. I don't even taste grapes in the grocery store. Just can't do it. Was mortified when the fellow I was shopping with once did it. I have an absolute horror of being caught stealing.


From: Urban prairie. | Registered: Sep 2001  |  IP: Logged
boadicea
recent-rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2987

posted 23 August 2002 02:25 PM      Profile for boadicea        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I HATE electronic surveillance alarms. It was a real downer for me when even progressive bookstores stated to use these presumptions of guilt, until proven innocent.

An anecdote. I had bought a book, at Lichtman's (Remember them, before Chapters and Indigo - I guess it's just Indigo, now - deep-sixed them).

I went to Towers (not sorry they restructured themselves, out of the Canadian market, but HMV does need some serious local competition. Have you seen their prices? They make the banks look like charities.) for my music fix.

Sure enough, off goes the alarm! A hulkish manager descended upon me like a ringwraith on a mission. I was asked to empty my backpack of books and papers. The damn aluminum strip, was hidden inside the book, from Lichtman's, mummified within plastic shrinkwrap.

Now when I enter a store, and trip the surveillance system, I shout, loudly, "Incoming!" and assume the position, arms spread upwards, and legs apart.

Store personnel usually approach me, in whispered tones, asking if they can demag my merchandise from another store.

They know I have the attention of their other customers.

b.

[ August 23, 2002: Message edited by: boadicea ]


From: Maple, Ontario | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Trespasser
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 1204

posted 24 August 2002 05:20 PM      Profile for Trespasser   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Hahahahahah! That's a good idea, to spread your arms and legs and get yourself prepared for the police search!

I hate those beepers too. They usually tend to go off on me for no reason. Just yesterday I went to the city library, took 5 video tapes and two books and sure, the person at the counter didn't de-sensitize each properly. They appear to be a bit quantity-chellenged, for whenever I take more than two things, I end up with the BEEEEP. When I carry books from one library to another, it'll happen. When I don't even have anything in my bag, it will happen regardless.


From: maritimes | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
Trisha
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 387

posted 24 August 2002 08:11 PM      Profile for Trisha     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
A short while ago, a young mother I know of chased her escaping 2 or 3 year old out a Zellers door into a mall while carrying a book she had intended to buy, leaving her other, slightly older child in the store. The store accused her of shoplifting and want to take her to court unless she pays an unbelievable high amount of money to them.

She tried to explain that the baby was in danger and she didn't even think of the book she was carrying. She came right back into the store with the child, put her into a cart and the book there too, so that should have proved she wasn't shoplifting. She was not out of the sight of the cashier at all. She also explained that there had been no carts at the entrance she came in. They were not only adamant about charging her but made their side of the affair public and barred her from the store for life.


From: Thunder Bay, Ontario | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
Moderator
Babbler # 560

posted 24 August 2002 08:59 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Isn't that something. I've walked out of stores with merchandise by accident. I've always gone back and paid for them, though - it's only honest.

That's unbelievable, that a store would press charges against a woman who was chasing a small child out of the store. I suppose there are people who use that as a ploy, but if she was coming right back in again, then come on. That's ridiculous. I'm sure I must have done that at least once with Amir. I can't remember a time, but I'm sure I've done it.

Silly, silly, silly. If I were that woman, I would have written to the papers about it and gotten as much bad publicity as possible for the store.


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
boadicea
recent-rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2987

posted 25 August 2002 11:50 AM      Profile for boadicea        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The aluminum bar locks, at my public library, when the security alarm goes off. It's like getting whacked in your privates by a two-by-four, if you don't hear the alarm.

The systems engineer who designed that surveillance device must have had links to a police riot squad.

"Whack 'em, and stack'em."

b.


From: Maple, Ontario | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Tommy_Paine
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 214

posted 25 August 2002 12:07 PM      Profile for Tommy_Paine     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Our local hardware store has a zero tollerance policy on shoplifting.

I've "shoplifted" twice there. Once my ex bought something that didn't get rung through. I attempted to get that rectified during my next purchase there, but the cashier laughed and said it was too much hassel, forget it.

The second time was when I bought some dryer vent. It's accordian in nature, and sold by the foot. I got about ten feet of it, and scrunched it up to carry it easier. At the checkout, I joked that I had "one foot of dryer vent." The cashier didn't pick up on it, and in spite of two confessions, rung it up as one foot.

Who am I to argue?

I don't shoplift not because I am above theft, but because the take isn't large enough. Now, if some $50,000 dollar item was able to fit into my pocket, who knows?

The part that bothers me about it, is that if we are going to have a zero tollerance policy on shoplifting, then the very same penalties should be assessed to the retailer when there is a discrepancy between the price marked on the good, and the price entered in the cash register computer.

It's the same offence. Theft is theft.

Walmart's anti theft electronics are infamously faulty. I bought a radio/cd player stereo for one of my girls there and the thing went off.

I never like shopping at Walmart in the first place and rarely did.

I certainly have not been back since, nor will I again.

There is a scam going on in London where a Walmart and other stores have hired a lawyer to contact parents of children who have shoplifted. They try to guilt the parents into paying for the good stolen, and for "court costs."


From: The Alley, Behind Montgomery's Tavern | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
audra trower williams
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2

posted 25 August 2002 12:25 PM      Profile for audra trower williams   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I "lifted" a mood ring from a toy store last year, just to see if it was any fun.
From: And I'm a look you in the eye for every bar of the chorus | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Tommy_Paine
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 214

posted 25 August 2002 12:39 PM      Profile for Tommy_Paine     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
de Sade (in either "Justine" or "Julliette", or likely both) wrote about people getting a sexual kick from petty theft.
From: The Alley, Behind Montgomery's Tavern | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
audra trower williams
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2

posted 25 August 2002 01:51 PM      Profile for audra trower williams   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I must have done something wrong.
From: And I'm a look you in the eye for every bar of the chorus | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Arch Stanton
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2356

posted 25 August 2002 02:18 PM      Profile for Arch Stanton     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
All property is theft.

Go ahead and shoplift, but be nice and don't steal from small shopkeepers.


From: Borrioboola-Gha | Registered: Mar 2002  |  IP: Logged
Trisha
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 387

posted 25 August 2002 11:08 PM      Profile for Trisha     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Michelle, the store and its head office got bombarded with letters about how unfair this was and that they were guilty of smearing an innocent's reputation. The newspapers were also told of this but refused to publish the letters. The store was Zellers, not in Thunder Bay. Since they are often in malls and have those wide open doorways, I'm sure she wasn't the first mother this happened to and won't be the last.

We haven't heard an update on this yet as it only happened in early July.


From: Thunder Bay, Ontario | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
jeff house
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 518

posted 26 August 2002 02:14 PM      Profile for jeff house     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I see Zellers letters from time to time, as clients come in with them. They have no more legal basis than if I write all "true" Babblers, asking each to send me $75.00. Then, like Zellers,
I write off the postage as a business expence.

Incidentally, bob Kellermann, a lawyer who works with me has just won a case in which the court held that any store security guard must comply with the Charter of Rights before searching a bag, as happened to Trespasser. The point is not free from doubt, because a store employee is not a
representative of the state, and the Charter protects only against the state, not private individuals.


From: toronto | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
'lance
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 1064

posted 26 August 2002 04:12 PM      Profile for 'lance     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
I must have done something wrong.

Maybe, Audra, you should have boosted something from the local equivalent of Womyn's Ware.


From: that enchanted place on the top of the Forest | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
Pogo
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2999

posted 27 August 2002 03:01 AM      Profile for Pogo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
When my wife and I moved back to BC from Toronto we tried to find a job on Vancouver Island with little luck. On weekends I would make mirror pedestals and take them to the Fulford Harbour on Saltspring for the flea market. Made enough money for the ferry ride home and fish chips.

The fellow next to me was selling wooden shelves and boxes made from an Ikea manufacturer's scraps. He told great stories of how he had tried working in mill for a year, but didn't like it. This was followed by a year as a postal carrier. Then he decided that he just didn't like work. He then spent 20 years on Valdez Island watching the seals play.

Anywise, I showed him a lid knob that I was using and bemoaned the fact that they cost so much --$7/each. He asked me how many I could use. The next week he showed up with a paper bag full. I asked how much and he said $.25/each. I asked where did you get these for 25 cents? "Oh, I steal them" was the matter of fact reply. Seeing that he had caughten me off guard he said, "Don't worry, I don't steal locally, I go up Island".

A couple of weeks later we received a response to one of our resume's in Vancouver and as the potter on the other side noted, "we went to over to the other side (paid employment)". Still do miss what we left behind.


From: Richmond BC | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Trespasser
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 1204

posted 27 August 2002 12:34 PM      Profile for Trespasser   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 

From: maritimes | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged

All times are Pacific Time  

Post New Topic  Post A Reply Close Topic    Move Topic    Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
Hop To:

Contact Us | rabble.ca | Policy Statement

Copyright 2001-2008 rabble.ca