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Topic: Homegrown Entrepreneurship
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Michael Hardner
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2595
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posted 27 November 2002 03:24 PM
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One piece of legislation would end 99% of these problems - end the prohibition on pot - but that would put the cops out of business as well as the blackmarketeers. Strange bedfellows are the cops and the dealers, but their interests are obviously linked.
I don't think the cops appreciate the workload that is associated with enforcing these laws. It seems to me we have been hearing rumblings that they tend to look the other way on this issue more and more often.There are problems with legalizing the drug, though. It's not a healthy product, and legalizing it would lead to more availability and therefore more use, I think. This sends a strange message to the public in terms of the government's direction vis-a-vis the heath of the population. It would also aggravate our relations with the US, and they would have various ways to apply pressure to prevent MJ from being decriminalized. That being said, I think it's time that MJ was brought in from the cold.
From: Toronto | Registered: May 2002
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Trinitty
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 826
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posted 27 November 2002 04:16 PM
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There are problems with legalizing the drug, though. It's not a healthy product, and legalizing it would lead to more availability and therefore more use, I think. This sends a strange message to the public in terms of the government's direction vis-a-vis the heath of the population.
Then make alcohol and fast food illegal, RIGHT NOW. Having alcohol, tobacco, caffiene, and all prescription drugs all deemed LEGAL, and this little cluster of other drugs (many of which have legal cousins) in a group called ILLEGAL is asinine! It makes absolutely no sense, even those who don't use most of the said "drugs". This ridiculous seperation only results in addicts or users being demonized or jailed or forgotten, lots of work for the police (trust me, the green teams are very lucrative overtime options for police), and a gold mine of revenue for violent gangs. Nobody's saying legalize any or all drugs because they are GOOD for us. (unless you include medicinal issues) They're saying legalize them, because nothing else makes any sense. Even if people never use them, GREAT, but keeping a select few of them illegal causes nothing but a MESS. I rarely ever drink. Alcohol kills thousands a year, it's very addictive, and it contributes to violence. BUT, prohibition of this substance DOES NOT WORK. BTW, do you know who funds "Partners for a Drug Free America"? and "D.A.R.E."? Pharmasuetical companies. It's amazing the clarity one gets when one keeps that fact nugget in mind next time one watches some of their "public service announcements".
From: Europa | Registered: Jun 2001
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Michael Hardner
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2595
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posted 27 November 2002 04:42 PM
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Then make alcohol and fast food illegal, RIGHT NOW.Having alcohol, tobacco, caffiene, and all prescription drugs all deemed LEGAL, and this little cluster of other drugs (many of which have legal cousins) in a group called ILLEGAL is asinine! It makes absolutely no sense, even those who don't use most of the said "drugs".
What I want to know is: Where did you learn that the world is supposed to make sense ?You're right it's inconsistent that MJ should be illegal, but making MJ legal will generally increase health problems IMO. quote:
This ridiculous seperation only results in addicts or users being demonized or jailed or forgotten, lots of work for the police (trust me, the green teams are very lucrative overtime options for police), and a gold mine of revenue for violent gangs.
Addicts ? I have never met a marijuana addict.If the cops like getting overtime, that's probably more of a reason that the men at the top don't like having to fight MJ. quote:
Nobody's saying legalize any or all drugs because they are GOOD for us. (unless you include medicinal issues) They're saying legalize them, because nothing else makes any sense.
Well, they could ignore the issue until the law eventually gets ignored, like those "No Riding a Horse on Sunday By-Laws". That way, no politican would have to stick his neck out. quote:
BTW, do you know who funds "Partners for a Drug Free America"? and "D.A.R.E."? Pharmasuetical companies.
I wasn't talking about America, but feel free to toss in any irrelevant points and I'll do the same.
From: Toronto | Registered: May 2002
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Jimmy Brogan
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 3290
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posted 27 November 2002 05:07 PM
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Addicts ? I have never met a marijuana addict.
Michael Hardner, I'm Jimmy Brogan. Now you have. Any social or medical problems associated with the legalization of marijuana are far outstripped by the problems of its continued prohibition. The diversion of police resources and the financing of criminal gangs are just two.
From: The right choice - Iggy Thumbscrews for Liberal leader | Registered: Nov 2002
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Trinitty
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 826
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posted 27 November 2002 05:09 PM
That's why I said users and addicts of illegal drugs, not marijuanna specifically. Heroin is addictive, so is cocaine, etc.Micheal, no need to be snarky, eh? I found the fact that drug companies are fighting "drugs" to be interesting, and wanted to share, 'tis all. Of course the world doesn't make sense, but if we can make certain things make more sense, then perhaps it will be contagious. Marijuanna has been said to not be physically addictive, without withdrawl symptoms. I'm sure there are some who can become dependant on it though, but I would hazard to guess they are the few. And, I specifically said that there are some who want illegal drugs made legal for medicinal reasons.
From: Europa | Registered: Jun 2001
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Trinitty
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 826
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posted 27 November 2002 05:16 PM
No, I'm not, pax. I just said that marijuanna has been found to not be physically addictive. Even if it is, it is beside the point. Caffiene and alchohol, and cough syrup, and french fries are addictive, should they be illegal? What about sex? Or picking scabs? Or video games? People can get addicted to lots of things, that doesn't mean we should make them illegal. Jimmy, I guess that explains the ability to eat a Coranary Burger? 
From: Europa | Registered: Jun 2001
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Jimmy Brogan
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 3290
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posted 27 November 2002 05:20 PM
I love my pot but there ain't enough of it in this town to get me to eat one of those.I mean there's munchies and then there's gluttony. Wanna split one? [ November 27, 2002: Message edited by: JimmyBrogan ]
From: The right choice - Iggy Thumbscrews for Liberal leader | Registered: Nov 2002
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flotsom
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2832
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posted 27 November 2002 05:25 PM
Well, in the case of psychological addiction to gambling the issue is of neurochemistry and, I suppose, physical addiction to the flood of dopamine to which gambling acts as catalyst. The same argument could easily be made in support of marijuana prohibition--it's psychological 'addictiveness'--but, as in the case of addiction to gambling, the habit-forming properties arrive in-built in the 'addict' him/herself, in the form of psychological predisposition in combination, perhaps, with a neurochemical sensitivity to low-levels of dopamine. In that sense, marijuana is potentially no more psychologically addictive than any pleasurable experience.[ November 27, 2002: Message edited by: flotsom ]
From: the flop | Registered: Jul 2002
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DrConway
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 490
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posted 27 November 2002 10:41 PM
I don't really care about whether or not pot is physically addictive.To me, the very existence of this whine by pot addicts who try to claim they're not addicted is just sophistry. Every addict I know who claims they can "quit pot right now because it's not physically addictive" nevertheless slobbers like Pavlov's dog as soon as someone yells "420!" or "TOOOOOOOOKE!" My attitude is "Like, I don't give a damn what you do on your own time, but don't try justify it to me, OK, because I really don't like BS." Legalize pot now, I say.
From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001
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mighty brutus
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 3148
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posted 28 November 2002 11:22 AM
I think you will find that most addiction experts will tell you that pot is addictive. The withdrawal symptoms are very real. Now don't get me wrong, I don't think someone who tokes should be thrown into jail, but in my case, it nearly ruined my life, and wreaked havoc on my career and relationships. I often wonder what I might have accomplished had I not had a 16 or 17 year love affair with the stuff. No, I did not have to commit crimes to support my habit, and I did hold down a steady job. I was also one mean, unpredictable MF'er if I did not have access to my stash. I don't think pot addicts are very well served by 12 step groups at the moment. AA doesn't want to talk about it, and at some NA groups you are considered some kind of lightweight, or 'not enough' of an addict. Today, after 3 years clean, I feel much better physically, and equally importantly, I have much better access to honest emotions. 
From: Beautiful Burnaby, British Columbia | Registered: Oct 2002
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Kindred
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 3285
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posted 28 November 2002 02:44 PM
Pot can be psychologically addicting is the way I understand it - And with all substances that we can consume in one way or another there will be those who abuse it. From everything I have read it isnt physically addictive, I know people who get downright nasty if they cant have chocolate or pepsi or coffee for that matter. Because of the tranquilizing effects of pot I believe the withdrawal spoken of is related to the anxiety of "returning to reality" and not having that "buffer" in place. Such symptoms would be anxiety, irritability, panic, nausea, headaches etc but these would relate more to a general inability to "cope" without some kind of pancea to escape into. I dont believe the body biological becomes dependent upon the drug per se. There may be physcial symptoms when you stop using it but none of these would be life threatening or as serious as with other drugs or substances, including alcohol. And they would be a manefestation of the loss of a psychological crutch - Not saying it isnt "real" but not a physical addiction or withdrawl - which is pretty harsh with seizures. The thing I keep coming back to is that I have never heard of anyone smoking up and then deciding to go out and kill people. There is so much heart ache and tragedy that arises from the use of alcohol that its amazing it is legal and pot isnt. But then its the poison preferred by our law makers isnt it? Yet detox from alcohol has the longest list of potential symptoms and serious complications associated with it And its apparently the drug of choice in our legal system
From: British Columbia | Registered: Nov 2002
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