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Author Topic: Are 15-minute breaks required by law?
prowsej
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posted 01 May 2006 04:19 PM      Profile for prowsej   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I got a job at Home Depot recently. During my training weekend, they said that they will always give us an hour of unpaid lunch time when we are working an 8-hour shift because it is required by Ontario law. However, they may not always give us a 15-minute break (to use the washroom, smoke, etc) in between the start of our shift and our lunch period which occurs about 4 hours into our shift. I am wondering if they are correct that the law in effect in Ontario does not require any breaks other than a lunch break.
From: Ottawa ON | Registered: Jun 2001  |  IP: Logged
N.Beltov
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posted 01 May 2006 04:46 PM      Profile for N.Beltov   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The laws have been changed in the last decade or so. It used to be the law in Manitoba that all employees were entitled to 2 such 15 minute breaks but not anymore. Chalk it up to the neocons and the end of the competition between capitalist and socialist countries; they don't feel the need to match the past social policies of the former socialist countries.

What does the law say about coffee breaks? Here is the relevant quote:

quote:
An employee must not work for more than five hours in a row without getting a 30-minute eating period (meal break) free from work. The law does not require an employer to provide any breaks in addition to this eating period. However, if the employer does provide another type of a break, such as a coffee break, and the employee must remain at his or her workplace during the break, the employee must be paid at least the minimum wage for that time.

[ 01 May 2006: Message edited by: N.Beltov ]


From: Vancouver Island | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
ceti
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posted 01 May 2006 05:06 PM      Profile for ceti     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Chalk it up to the neocons and the end of the competition between capitalist and socialist countries; they don't feel the need to match the past social policies of the former socialist countries.

Damn it, I want the Soviet Union back... I need my break!

quote:
Russian police spokesman, Viktor Biryukov, said trade unionists marched peacefully through central Moscow calling for a "social state," according to Itar-Tass news agency.

A smaller group of Communist Party supporters marched from Lenin monument on October Square to their usual rally spot at the Karl Marx statue. They chanted "Putin resign!", "Our Homeland is the USSR".

BBC News



From: various musings before the revolution | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
prowsej
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posted 01 May 2006 05:08 PM      Profile for prowsej   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Thanks for confirming that: I didn't think that Home Depot would get the law wrong, but I wanted to check anyways. So, I guess when they force me to buy my own safety equipment on my own buck (like steel-toed shoes) and provide no compensation, then they're in the clear too. I guess when they refuse to pay me for the time it takes to put on said safety equipment (like the steel-toed shoes, or a back brace if needed) then they are also in the clear. I guess when they call me to cancel shifts that they scheduled me on three weeks in advance, giving me less than 24-hours notice that I am not to come to work, they are in the clear (even though I need to give them 3 weeks notice to take time off, they can cancel my shifts with less than 24 hours notice).
From: Ottawa ON | Registered: Jun 2001  |  IP: Logged
N.Beltov
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posted 01 May 2006 05:16 PM      Profile for N.Beltov   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
prowsej:
...I guess when they force me to buy my own safety equipment on my own buck (like steel-toed shoes) and provide no compensation, then they're in the clear
...I guess when they refuse to pay me for the time it takes to put on said safety equipment (like the steel-toed shoes, or a back brace if needed) then they are also in the clear.
...I guess when they call me to cancel shifts that they scheduled me on three weeks in advance, giving me less than 24-hours notice that I am not to come to work, they are in the clear ...

Don't guess, goddamit. Check the law. And talk to some longer-term employess [that you trust!] about benefits that the managers don't tell you about. Even without a union you should arm yourself with the facts.


From: Vancouver Island | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
slimpikins
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posted 01 May 2006 07:25 PM      Profile for slimpikins     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Prowsej, it sounds like you are getting screwed over at work. Might I reccomend contacting a Union? If the other workers there feel as you do, maybe a Union is what you need. That way, you would have some control over things like wages, hours of work, shift scheduling, rest periods, and the like through negotiating a collective agreement, that would cover those issues. I am a member of UFCW, and I like it, but don't take my word for it. Check out other Unions as well, like the Teamsters, SEIU, Steelworkers, and the CAW.
From: Alberta | Registered: May 2005  |  IP: Logged
Fidel
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posted 01 May 2006 08:31 PM      Profile for Fidel     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by prowsej:
Thanks for confirming that: I didn't think that Home Depot would get the law wrong, but I wanted to check anyways. So, I guess when they force me to buy my own safety equipment on my own buck (like steel-toed shoes) and provide no compensation, then they're in the clear too.

I'm with N.Beltov. As far as I know, no more than five hours at a time without a 30 minute food break. And if you can't take two 15's, well, it just goes to show what they think of the workers.

ETA: Keep this in mind and never forget: English coal mine owners used to require children, and some as young as four and five years old were on record as having been down in the pits, to buy company candles at inflated prices. The poor little buggers worked twelve hours and had no real breaks and no suppers. Imagine the rats coming and stealing your bread and cheese in the pitch dark and coughing on coal dust all day. Your joints ache by the time you're twelve from pulling coal tubs all day long in the dark.

By GOOM! Stand up for your rights, laddy!

[ 01 May 2006: Message edited by: Fidel ]


From: Viva La Revolución | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
Fear-ah
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posted 01 May 2006 08:54 PM      Profile for Fear-ah        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by prowsej:
I got a job at Home Depot recently. During my training weekend, they said that they will always give us an hour of unpaid lunch time when we are working an 8-hour shift because it is required by Ontario law.

If they are giving you full-time shifts, shut up...it's precisely that type of complaining that your 'group leader' is suppose to note at assessment and will get you knocked down to mostly P/T or worst.

With shithole 'gigs' like that, it's basically a decision to work there...if your complaining already about 15 minute breaks, then it ain't a good fit and you should probably keep looking.

Could be worst...you could be getting less hourly wages by being employed, instead through a temp agency, and then being assigned to work at Home Depot and complain about 15 minute breaks!!

Quit while your ahead...


From: Vancouver | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
Anti-Totalitarian
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posted 01 May 2006 09:10 PM      Profile for Anti-Totalitarian        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
From the Ontario Employment Standards website:

What does the law say about coffee breaks?

An employee must not work for more than five hours in a row without getting a 30-minute eating period (meal break) free from work. The law does not require an employer to provide any breaks in addition to this eating period. However, if the employer does provide another type of a break, such as a coffee break, and the employee must remain at his or her workplace during the break, the employee must be paid at least the minimum wage for that time.

Source
(go about halfway down the page)

Unfortunate, isn't it?


From: somewhere in subspace | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
Fidel
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posted 01 May 2006 09:27 PM      Profile for Fidel     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
"worse"

And I still say talk to your fellow workers about being short-changed with your breaks. Most good managers are approachable regarding work issues. And if you're not taking 15 minute breaks, make damn sure they're not docking you for them anyway.


From: Viva La Revolución | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
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posted 01 May 2006 09:36 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
prowsej, it sounds like you're really getting screwed over. A minimum wage job that makes you buy your own uniform and equipment? That really sucks.

The problem with trying to organize in a job like that is that people are often only in it for the short term, like a summer job, and the results don't come in the short run. It's a nasty catch-22 - if you don't need the job that badly, or you're only going to be there a short time, it's not worth the incredibly hard work of organizing, but if you do need the job badly and are afraid of getting fired, then organizing can feel pretty scary.

I often look back on my bakery days, though, and wish I had tried to get my co-workers to unionize. I think most of them wouldn't have gone for it, though. Most of them were against unions because they claimed that unions chase away jobs. It was hard to believe that they thought our boss couldn't afford to give us more than six bucks an hour at the time when he had a huge house, a cottage, a car and an SUV. But there you go.


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
jas
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posted 01 May 2006 10:06 PM      Profile for jas     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I remember the first job I encountered that told me that my lunch break was only a half an hour, and secondly, unpaid. (We did have 2 scheduled coffee breaks). Not only an unpaid half-hour, but they were allowed to tell me when I had to take it! Something has never felt right to me about that: if you're not paying me for that half hour, then you can't tell me when to use it, beyond a strict adherence to the law, ie; after five hours of the work day. So ultimately the workday is actually 8 and 1/2 hours. In other words, I was required to be there from 8 - 4:30 (not 4) and yet I was only paid for 8 hours. Something feels very unfair about that to me. Why shouldn't someone then be able to take a 1.5 hr unpaid lunch break if they want...if it's unpaid...? The answer of course is that in most worksites, you need to be there when others are there. I think that's something that needs to be revisited though.
From: the world we want | Registered: Jun 2005  |  IP: Logged
1ndiemuse
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posted 01 May 2006 10:07 PM      Profile for 1ndiemuse     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I've done some work in the resturant industry in the past (waitress/line cook) and it always was the same thing. You could take a quick break at some point throughout the day when it wasn't busy. And by quick break I mean wolf down a meal and god help you if your a smoker. I always wondered how resturants are able to get away with this? Bars as well. Thinking about it, in a crowded bar on any given Fri/Sat night bartenders are absolutely going 5 or 6 hours without a break. So what's the deal?
From: Everybody knows this is nowhere . . . | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
mayakovsky
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posted 01 May 2006 10:34 PM      Profile for mayakovsky     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Wow! In Quebec we get an half hour lunch and a fifteen minute coffee break over eight hours. Granted we are allowed to take longer if the coffee is too hot to consume in 15min. We are also given 5min per hour for a smoke break which if we do not use for a full year we get our rent paid by the government. And that one hour love consumation break at 2pm.

Nah, just eight hours with one half hour lunch break unpaid and fifteen minutes coffee paid.


From: New Bedford | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
jas
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posted 01 May 2006 11:20 PM      Profile for jas     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 

I was almost believing you...until the rent paid by government thing.

[ 01 May 2006: Message edited by: jas ]


From: the world we want | Registered: Jun 2005  |  IP: Logged
prowsej
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posted 01 May 2006 11:26 PM      Profile for prowsej   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I should say that I'm new to the job: I'm not even out of the 3-month-probation period where "either party can terminate the contract without notice". I also wasn't a big fan of the form they made all new hires sign consenting to drug testing ("ohh, that's superceded by Canadian law anyways-just sign it since it's unenforcable. Only American paperwork" they said).

I'm working the job precisely because I wanted something short term to earn a bit of money before going on a trip, and when thinking of short term employment, one thinks of such benefit-less jobs. It's not something I could do for the long haul - I don't have the back for something that requires such heavy lifting! (already getting spasms and I'm just 22)

Thanks for the comments and suggestions, y'all.


From: Ottawa ON | Registered: Jun 2001  |  IP: Logged
oldgoat
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posted 01 May 2006 11:29 PM      Profile for oldgoat     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I'm given a job to do, and paid for 7 hours a day. Within certain limits, how I juggle the job and the seven hours is up to me. I work a lot out in the community, and except for certain staff and team meetings I totally self schedule. I give myself lots of little breaks through the day, and mostly don't bother with lunch.

At this point in my career I'd have a very hard time thinking in terms of structured breaks and lunches.


From: The 10th circle | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
prowsej
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posted 01 May 2006 11:32 PM      Profile for prowsej   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
What sort of work do you do, oldgoat?
From: Ottawa ON | Registered: Jun 2001  |  IP: Logged
oldgoat
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posted 01 May 2006 11:43 PM      Profile for oldgoat     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Damn little!

ok, just kidding. I'm something called a community case manager with the Canadian Mental Health Assoc. in Toronto. I carry a caseload of about 16-18 people who have been diagnosed with schizophrenia, bi-polar, major depression,that sort of thing. (note I'm not saying they have it, but they wear the diagnosis) my teams specialty is working with Scarboroughs multicultural community.

What I do is a lot of supportive counselling, assistance with life skills, helping with issues like isolation, sometimes full concierge services, and a lot of advocacy with government and mediating on behalf of my clients with a hostile world. Someday ask me about the ODSP.

My wonderful team consists of two Tamil workers, an Afghani and a Somali. I'm the token white guy. Oh yeah, my team leader is from south London. Diagnosis aside, I find I'm dealing with a lot of post traumatic stress stuff and immigration adjustment issues.


From: The 10th circle | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
Reason
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posted 01 May 2006 11:49 PM      Profile for Reason   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by prowsej:
Thanks for confirming that: I didn't think that Home Depot would get the law wrong, but I wanted to check anyways. So, I guess when they force me to buy my own safety equipment on my own buck (like steel-toed shoes) and provide no compensation, then they're in the clear too. I guess when they refuse to pay me for the time it takes to put on said safety equipment (like the steel-toed shoes, or a back brace if needed) then they are also in the clear. I guess when they call me to cancel shifts that they scheduled me on three weeks in advance, giving me less than 24-hours notice that I am not to come to work, they are in the clear (even though I need to give them 3 weeks notice to take time off, they can cancel my shifts with less than 24 hours notice).

Wouldn't said requirements for safety equipment be considered a tax deduction? I am pretty sure they are, but then I am no tax wiz (hence the nasty gram I got from CRA this year lol).

Keep your receipts, and hopefully someone here can tell more on this then I.


From: Ontario | Registered: Jun 2005  |  IP: Logged
Who?
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posted 02 May 2006 10:51 AM      Profile for Who?     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Where I work it's required you get a 15 minute breakfor anything under 6 hours. Anything between 6 and 8 hours and you can take an unpaid half hour and a fifteen or two paid fifteen minute breaks. Nine hours (ex 8-5) and it's required you get your hour break and two fifteens throughout the course of the day.

I live in NS and I believe it's the law as I don't think this company would give it to you if they didn't have to

Do the labour laws vary from province to province that much?

[ 02 May 2006: Message edited by: Who? ]


From: Eastern Canada | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged
Fear-ah
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posted 02 May 2006 11:37 AM      Profile for Fear-ah        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Who?:

Do the labour laws vary from province to province that much?

Nope...best thing to do is elect a social democratic party who will upon the first day of their new mandate make all these changes to bring a basic level of fairness and dignity to the average worker.

Should be pretty easy as many many social democrats come from the union movement, social work, universities, so they have their ear to the ground as far as the averag worker goes...in fact many at one time in their youth for a brief period vaguely remember those kinds of jobs.


From: Vancouver | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
N.Beltov
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posted 02 May 2006 03:21 PM      Profile for N.Beltov   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Fear-ah: Nope...best thing to do is elect a social democratic party who will upon the first day of their new mandate make all these changes to bring a basic level of fairness and dignity to the average worker.

Too bad we don't have any in Canada. The nearest thing is the NDP that used to be a social democratic party.

All sarcasm aside, we don't have anti-scab legislation in Manitoba or Saskatchewan despite the fact that we've had NDP administrations for some time. The NDP has to be pushed hard; the good thing is that they're more amenable to being pushed than the Liberals or the Conservatives.


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Polunatic2
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posted 02 May 2006 04:12 PM      Profile for Polunatic2   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I have a unionised job in a large bargaining unit with hundreds of worksites. The contract language on breaks goes something like "...breaks shall continue as per past practice".

In other words, if there were already breaks in place at the worksite, you were entitled to one like everyone else there. If there weren't, then no-go. If you have them and don't use them, you can lose them after a certain period of time which is why the supervisors are reluctant to inform people about them.

In another job I had 30 years ago (yikes), I worked in the curling bar of a golf and country club. There was no lunch, dinner or any other kind of break. You could take bites in between serving people. When I insisted that we were legally entitled to 1/2 hour after 5 hours, they granted it to me but no one else dared follow my lead. Then they fired me.


From: Toronto | Registered: Mar 2006  |  IP: Logged
Summer
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posted 02 May 2006 04:40 PM      Profile for Summer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Reason:

Wouldn't said requirements for safety equipment be considered a tax deduction? I am pretty sure they are, but then I am no tax wiz (hence the nasty gram I got from CRA this year lol).

Keep your receipts, and hopefully someone here can tell more on this then I.


You'd think so wouldn't you...The Income Tax Act is really, really restrictive as to what employees can deduct from income. They can deduct "supplies that were consumed directly in the performance of the duteis of the office of employment and that the officer or employer was required by the contract of employment to pay for". Unfortunately, clothing, even uniforms, do not meet this definition. See http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/E/pub/tp/it352r2/it352r2-e.html#P58_7226 under supplies. It's quite ridiculous really, as if a Home Depot employee is going to wear their uniform for anything other than working at Home Depot...but they could if they wanted to.


From: Ottawa | Registered: Apr 2006  |  IP: Logged
prowsej
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posted 02 May 2006 06:02 PM      Profile for prowsej   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well, I think there are issues with Home Depot (like their employment contract states that the Home Depot "may unilaterally alter the terms of this contract at any time without notice" [paraphrased] - usually a contract is something that both parties agree to, not just one!) but the only actual uniform that we have is an orange apron that we wear, and we're given that for free (it's just Steel toed boots that we have to buy). And it's not quite minimum wage (much like Walmart, I take it) - but the wages vary without any seeming explanation - different people in my department doing exactly the same work as me, who have been there both longer and for less time than me, are earning more or less money than me, without any seeming pattern.
From: Ottawa ON | Registered: Jun 2001  |  IP: Logged

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