Here is the report from the NYT

NYT report that Bush commuted Libby's prison sentence

So much for the rule of law. Libby should have been hung for treason for outing an intelligence agent. Any doubt that Bush is a dictator and considers himself above the law have been removed.

Bush is daring Americans to stand up to his criminality...because if they do, he'll pull a terrorist event that will dwarf 9/11. He'd just love to round out his second term of office with a nuclear attack on American soil.

gc

[ 02 July 2007: Message edited by: greencrow ]

it's now a diversion from coverage of one of the greatest criminal acts in the history of the united states...Bush's brazen flaunting of the law, interference with the criminal justice system....his cronyism, his mafia don like bravado...The United States of America has been taken over by a criminal cartel who wants one of their capos protected.

That's the story you WON'T be seeing on your TV news.

quote:

---

Originally posted by greencrow:
Libby should have been hung for treason for outing an intelligence agent. [...]

... one of the greatest criminal acts in the history of the united states...Bush's brazen flaunting of the law, interference with the criminal justice system...

---

Mmmhmmm.

I haven't been this excited since Ford pardoned Nixon.

Or since Cheney arrived somewhere 27 minutes late.

Buzzflash editorial on NYT coverage of the Libby commutation

When you think that the United States, in the past 10 years has increased its incarcerated population to the point where it has the most imprisoned population per capita in the world...

And when you think that Bush, when he was governor of Texas, sent the most prisoners to the electric chair.... and never once commuted a death sentence...

You know that he has just spit in the faces of all Americans...how they will respond is the next question.

I went out and watched Michael Moore's movie 'Sicko' yesterday afternoon. It is a very good movie, it has a lot of laughs and tears...but one thing Moore keeps asking...why does the US government treat its citizens so poorly? His answer is that the government wants to keep them sick and terrorized and broke just for occasions such as this...so they won't speak out when they get a gob of spittle in their faces from the likes of George W. Bush.

gc

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: greencrow ]

Of course, someone finally sliced the Gordian knot by usurping the Republic. Julius something or other, if memory serves.

Is the pardoning of Libby the crossing of a Rubicon?

Naw, not yet.

quote:

---

Libby should have been hung for treason for outing an intelligence agent.

---

Why should you care whether or not a terrorist from the CIA was outed? They are no doubt operating in Canada as spys. As such, they should be accorded the traditional welcome that all spys receive when revealed.

The outing of Plame probably saved lives. Who knows what her real role at the CIA was? For all we know, her job was to manufacture evidence for a pretext to attack Iran.

quote:

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Originally posted by greencrow:
So much for the rule of law.

---

The "rule of law" means acting within the law. Bush acted within the law by granting the reprieve.

Article II, Section 2 of the U.S. Constitution says, "The President...shall have Power to Grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment."

You may disagree with the wisdom of the commutation of the sentence (I question it) but the act was lawful because, other than in the case of impeachment, the president has the absolute right to grant reprieves to whomever he chooses for whatever reason. It's a constitutional power vested in the president.

quote:

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Originally posted by Tommy_Paine:
Is the pardoning of Libby the crossing of a Rubicon?

---

quote:

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Originally posted by Greencow:
Libby should have been hung for treason for outing an intelligence agent.

---

A little word fun: Coats and pictures (and sometimes juries) are “hung”. A criminal executed by hanging is “hanged”.

quote:

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Originally posted by Jingles:
Why should you care whether or not a terrorist from the CIA was outed?

---

ETA: If I had been the judge, I would have skipped the fine and sentenced him to six months in prison.

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: Sven ]

quote:

---

Tough enough to execute Karla Fay Tucker -- and then laugh about it. Tough enough to sign a death warrant for a man whose lawyer slept through the trial -- and then snicker when asked about it in a debate. Even tough enough to execute a great-grandmother who murdered her husband -- after he abused her. A friend of mine at the time asked Bush to commute her sentence, telling him, "Betty Lou ain't a threat to no one she ain't married to." No dice.

---

quote:

---

The "rule of law" means acting within the law.

---

Any sign the American people are about to rise up? Depends. What's on TV?

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: Frustrated Mess ]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Frustrated Mess:
[QBWhat's on TV?[/QB]

---

American Idol, perhaps?

Few people care. People have become so cynical that they just tune out all of the news.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Briguy:
Why didn't he just wait until January, like every other president before him?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by tostig:
Bush's act is clearly the politicization of the US judicial system. Only one other parallel can be drawn from US history and that is the pardon of Richard Nixon by Gerald Ford. Note: in both situations, they are Republicans.

I may be too young or too ill-informed but I can't recall another parallel in any other Western Democracy.

---

Bush-Libby is not even comparable to Ford-Nixon.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sven:

The "rule of law" means acting within the law. Bush acted within the law by granting the reprieve.

Article II, Section 2 of the U.S. Constitution says, "The President...shall have Power to Grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offenses against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment."

You may disagree with the wisdom of the commutation of the sentence (I question it) but the act was lawful because, other than in the case of impeachment, the president has the absolute right to grant reprieves to whomever he chooses for whatever reason. It's a constitutional power vested in the president.

---

The Rule of Law as a philosophical concept is more rigorous than merely following the letter of the law. It is the concept that we should all be subject to the law, rather than being governed by the arbitrary whims of those in positions of power.

"Why should you care whether or not a terrorist from the CIA was outed? They are no doubt operating in Canada as spys. As such, they should be accorded the traditional welcome that all spys receive when revealed.

The outing of Plame probably saved lives. Who knows what her real role at the CIA was? For all we know, her job was to manufacture evidence for a pretext to attack Iran.

The CIA and its minions are not victims. They are a vast criminal organization that is the enemy of free peoples everywhere."

. . . . . . .

Actually, the outing of Plame did cost lives...there were several assassinations of Brewster Jennings employees in several foreign countries after she was outed.

Yes, the CIA is a vast criminal organization but that has nothing to do with the question under debate. Even if Libby was a mass murderer or a monk...that has no bearing on the fact that he was convicted in a court of law, his conviction was being appealed and the appeal of his imprisonment during the course of the appeal was rejected by the appellate court...five hours later, Bush commuted his sentence.

Strictly speaking, did Bush have the power to commute Libby's sentence? Yes. But there's also the matter of cronyism and conflict of interest, avoidance of both have traditionally prevented this kind of intervention from politicians.

Now that that taboo has been broken. Who knows what other legal taboos will be broken...they might (for instance) start torturing people or committing mass murders in the name of a War on Terrah.

Hey, they've already done those things...all bets are off...now they might start to:

- Poison the skys and alter the weather with chemtrails

- Begin construction on a super highway, six lanes across all the way from the Mexican border up to Winnipeg which will effectively divide the continent and provide a venue for a massive military invasion of neighbours in either direction

- build a site in the Artic from which they beam down pulsating lasers onto earth via satellite with the power of causing huge earthquakes and tsunamies anywhere on earth

- Cause epidemics including AIDS by manufacturing man-made viruses in labs and then injecting whole continents of people with the vaccine.

- Manufacture anthrax in a military lab and then terrorize the population with it via a false flag attack. Make sure they plant the anthrax bacteria in their political opponents offices.

- embark on a series of selective assassinations of public figures who they think might provide some opposition to their policies, (past victims include but are not limited to Princess Diana, JFK, RFK MLK, MX, JFK Jr. and several senators and independent journalists).

gc

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: greencrow ]

quote:

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Originally posted by remind:
Question, do we have something similar to this type of action available in Canada?

---

Yes, it stems fro the royal prerogative of "clemency". Anyone may apply to the Governor-General for commutation or resinding of a sentence. I have no idea how often these actually are granted.

Pardons after the fact, of course, are generally available on application to the National Parole Board, either 3 years (summary) or 5 years (indictment) after conviction or serving the sentence.

quote:

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Originally posted by Draco:
The Rule of Law as a philosophical concept is more rigorous than merely following the letter of the law. It is the concept that we should all be subject to the law, rather than being governed by the arbitrary whims of those in positions of power.

A discretionary power of commutation in itself may or may not be compatible with the Rule of Law, but exercising such a power on behalf of political allies certainly isn't.

---

"...Don't blame the president, blame the constitution.

. . . . . . . .

A constitution is a tool and is only as good as the politicians that utilize it.

You can't blame an inanimate object for a human decision...

Reminds me of the saying

'Even the devil can quote scripture'.

Voice of the White House July 2, 2007
TBR News.org – July 2, 2007

“The media is jabbering away about the Libby pardon, criticizing the Head Chimpanzee for flouting the law.

Let’s study why he did such a politically stupid thing. At one time, Libby was Vice President Dick Cheney's Chief of Staff. He was the chief pro-Israel Jewish advisor to Cheney, which helps explains why Cheney was so determined to invade Iraq. Libby has been a longtime associate of Wolfowitz and was also a lawyer for convicted felon and Israeli spy Mark Rich, whom Clinton pardoned in his last days as president.

Why did Bush pardon Libby? Simply because Libby was a man who knew too much.

He was designated to take the fall for Cheney on the Plame business but drew the line at jail time. Libby saw to it that the brass in the White House knew that if he had to go to prison, he would sing like an opera star at La Scala and like a good singer, he would certainly bring down the house.

What would Libby talk about? Well, the plans to institute official torture cooked up by Cheney and eagerly approved by Bush. Cheney’s obscene rake-offs from the Halliburton scams, serious scandals about Gannon’s nocturnal visits to the White House and who he was fudge-packing, Karl Rove’s chronic blackmail of anyone who got in Bush’s way, Bush and Cheney’s outspoken contempt for blacks and their obedience to Israeli demands, Cheney’s determination to establish Iraq as a permanent forward military base to secure Iraqi oil for the US and his friends and serve as a launching pad for attacks on Israeli’s enemies, plans to oust Putin and regain control over Russian oil and gas fields, deliberately falsified “terror alerts” and, worse of all, knowingly launching an attack on Iraq using officially falsified CIA reports.

How many have died because of these two evil men? Libby knows and that’s why dear old Scooter, convicted of several serious felonies, goes free. It sure ain’t compassion because George has a heart the size of a mustard seed and has strong sadistic tendencies. Maybe Libby would tell them about the movies George and his evil friends used to watch upstairs in the private quarters showing terrible tortures at Gitmo and in Iraq.

Believe me, these are very sick people who should be in a nice jail of their own and not dictating to the American people and killing their sons.”

[URL=www.tbrnews.org/Archives/a2712.htm]TBR news[/URL]

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: greencrow ]

quote:

---

The constitution (both "philosophically" and by "the letter of the law") grants the president the absolute power to grant reprieves and pardons as the president sees fit (for any reason or no reason at all). If that power is to be limited, then the constitution would have to be amended. Don't blame the president, blame the constitution.

---

I don't think the Constitution pardoned Scooter Libby.

In context, this pardon is a completely heinous act. Libby helped the Administration to punish a dissenter. He made sure that congress could not find out WHO it was who outed Valery Plame because her husband criticized the Bush Administration in an article in the New York Times.

The President is therefore not independent in this matter. The crime occurred to protect his administration, and pardoning Libby is just a way of insuring that Libby doesn't squeal.

quote:

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Originally posted by unionist:
Yes, it stems fro the royal prerogative of "clemency". Anyone may apply to the Governor-General for commutation or resinding of a sentence. I have no idea how often these actually are granted.

Pardons after the fact, of course, are generally available on application to the National Parole Board, either 3 years (summary) or 5 years (indictment) after conviction or serving the sentence.

But it's the GG's power which is analogous to that of the U.S. President.

---

Okay thanks now that I know this was able to google it.

The Leut Gov's of the Provinces are also able to do this. But it appears it has not been used since capital punishment days that I could find.

quote:

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Originally posted by trippie:
Bush let Libby out of jail because they are all one big happy family.... they all think the same and want the same things....

You scratch my back and Ill scratch yours...

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Sven:

The constitution (both "philosophically" and by "the letter of the law") grants the president the absolute power to grant reprieves and pardons as the president sees fit (for any reason or no reason at all). If that power is to be limited, then the constitution would have to be amended. Don't blame the president, blame the constitution.

---

If the President has "absolute power" to pardon, then his pardoning power cannot exemplify "the rule of law."

quote:

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Originally posted by Blondin:
I suspect it's more like "You don't stab me in the back and I won't stab you in the back".

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by greencrow:
unionist:

"...Don't blame the president, blame the constitution.

. . . . . . . .

A constitution is a tool and is only as good as the politicians that utilize it.

You can't blame an inanimate object for a human decision...

Reminds me of the saying

'Even the devil can quote scripture'.

gc

---

greencrow, please slow down and take a little time before posting. Then you will perhaps notice that it is Sven who said "don't blame the president, blame the constitution" - not unionist.

quote:

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Originally posted by tostig:
Bush's act is clearly the politicization of the US judicial system. Only one other parallel can be drawn from US history and that is the pardon of Richard Nixon by Gerald Ford. Note: in both situations, they are Republicans.

---

I hope you're not one of those "Republican: bad, Democrat: good" theorists. They are both slightly different shades of imperialist charcoal. They are certainly both corrupt to the core, as is U.S. "democracy" as a whole. So I don't mean to burst your bubble when I quote the following:

quote:

---

Clinton issued 140 pardons as well as several commutations on his last day of office (January 20, 2001). When a sentence is commuted, the conviction remains intact, but the sentence can be altered in a number of ways. Some controversial actions include the following:

* Carlos A. Vignali had his sentence for cocaine trafficking commuted, after serving 6 of 15 years in federal prison.

* Almon Glenn Braswell was pardoned of his mail fraud and perjury convictions, even while a federal investigation was underway regarding additional money laundering and tax evasion charges. Braswell and Carlos Vignali each paid approximately $200,000 to Hillary Clinton's brother, Hugh Rodham, to represent their respective cases for clemency. Hugh Rodham returned the payments after they were disclosed to the public. Braswell would later invoke the Fifth Amendment at a Senate Committee hearing in 2001, when questioned about allegations of his having systematically defrauded senior citizens of millions of dollars.

* Marc Rich, a fugitive, was pardoned of tax evasion, after clemency pleas from Israeli prime minister Ehud Barak, among many other international luminaries. Denise Rich, Marc's former wife, was a close friend of the Clintons and had made substantial donations to both Clinton's library and Hillary's Senate campaign. Clinton agreed to a pardon that required Marc Rich to pay a $100,000,000 fine before he could return to the United States. According to Paul Volcker's independent investigation of Iraqi Oil-for-Food kickback schemes, Marc Rich was a middleman for several suspect Iraqi oil deals involving over 4 million barrels of oil.

* Susan McDougal, who had already completed her sentence, was pardoned for her role in the Whitewater scandal; McDougal had served 18 months on contempt charges for refusing to testify about Clinton's role.

* Dan Rostenkowski, a former Democratic Congressman convicted in the Congressional Post Office Scandal. Rostenkowski had served his entire sentence.

* Melvin J. Reynolds, a Democratic Congressman from Illinois, who was convicted of bank fraud, 12 counts of sexual assault, obstruction of justice, and solicitation of child pornography had his sentence commuted on the bank fraud charged and was allowed to serve the final months under the auspices of a half way house. He had served his entire sentence on child sex abuse charges before the commutation of the later convictions.

* Roger Clinton, the president's half-brother, on drug charges after having served the entire sentence more than a decade before. Roger Clinton would be charged with drunk driving and disorderly conduct in an unrelated incident within a year of the pardon. He was also briefly alleged to have been utilized in lobbying for the Braswell pardon, among others.

---

Source.

I'm quite sure a historic look at other presidents (of both shades of evil) will reveal a similar pattern.

That's why (to repeat myself ad nauseam) this Libby thing is a non-story.

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: unionist ]

quote:

---

Originally posted by remind:

The Leut Gov's of the Provinces are also able to do this. But it appears it has not been used since capital punishment days that I could find.

---

This CBC backgrounder dating from 2004 claims that the "Royal Prerogative of Mercy" had been used 159 times since 1980 - which makes it rare, but it has been used.

quote:

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Originally posted by jrootham:
Bush is not just corrupt. He is trying to subvert the government. [...] This is far less serious than what Libby is helping to do.

---

I honestly don't get it. Libby's conviction and fine still stand, but Bush says he doesn't have to do prison time.

How does this "subvert the government" - by contrast, say, with holding hundreds of people forever without charges or access to the U.S. judicial system?

If this is truly a big deal, I still haven't grasped why.

ETA: What did you think of this (from the same source as cited in my previous post) - did he not subvert two other branches of government?

quote:

---

On August 11, 1999, Clinton commuted the sentences of 16 members of FALN, a violent Puerto Rican nationalist group that set off 120 bombs in the United States mostly in New York City and Chicago, convicted for conspiracies to commit robbery, bomb-making, and sedition, as well as for firearms and explosives violations. None of the 16 were convicted of bombings or any crime which injured another person, though they were sentenced with terms ranging from 35 to 105 years in prison for the conviction of conspiracy and sedition. Congress, however, recognizes that the FALN is responsible for "6 deaths and the permanent maiming of dozens of others, including law enforcement officials." All of the 16 had served 19 years or longer in prison, which was a longer sentence than such crimes typically received, according to the White House. Clinton offered clemency, on condition that the prisoners renounce violence, at the appeal of 10 Nobel Peace Prize laureates, President Jimmy Carter, the cardinal of New York, and the archbishop of Puerto Rico. The commutation was opposed by U.S. Attorney's Office, the FBI, and the Federal Bureau of Prisons and criticized by many including former victims of FALN terrorist activities, the Fraternal Order of Police, members of Congress, and Hillary Clinton in her campaign for Senator. Congress condemned the action, with a vote of 95-2 in the Senate and 311-41 in the House. The U.S. House Committee on Government Reform held an investigation on the matter, but the Justice Department prevented FBI officials from testifying. President Clinton cited executive privilege for his refusal to turn over some documents to Congress related to his decision to offer clemency to members of the FALN terrorist group.

---

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: unionist ]

The Libby commutation is a small part of the subversion of government. When I wrote that Bush is trying to subvert the government I meant the whole thing, violating wiretap laws, signing statements, refusal to accept congressional oversight, packing the courts, etc, etc.

Commutation as opposed to pardon is a cute trick. As skdadl pointed out on BnR, if Libby was pardoned he could be yanked back into a grand jury room and asked the same questions again without being able to invoke the fifth amendment. This way, he is immune from that.

As far as the case you cited, I would characterize that as a political disagreement expressed in a situation where there is no congressional check on the Presidents power. Clinton was doing a political deal with political terrorists, Congress disagreed. Clinton was not pardoning them because they would testify about his wrongdoing.

What I still don't understand is why the Libby case is significant. Call me dense, please, but spell it out for me.

ETA: Let me elaborate. I understand the point about commutation vs. pardon. But what is the difference between: (a) doing nothing, and (b) commuting the sentence, other than he's doing a friend a favour? Why is (b) vs. (a) such a big deal? It's not as if Libby was a mass murderer or war criminal.

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: unionist ]

from WHATREALLYHAPPENED.com

CINDY SHEEHAN IS BACK IN BUSINESS!

copied from the blog "Desert Peace"

Just had this sent to me by my cousin.... needs no introduction...
Cindy is back with the same enthusiasm she always had!
WELCOME BACK SIS!

Call Out the Instigator
Cindy Sheehan

Call out the Instigator
Because there's something in the air
We got to get together sooner or later
Because the revolution's here
You know it's right!
Thunderclap Newman

"I'm not backing off. I tried to remove myself from the political realm of the US, what BushCo is turning into an Evil Empire, but the blatant audacity of George commuting Scooter's sentence (he's not ruling out a full pardon ---and you know he will) has dragged me kicking and screaming back in. I can't sit back and let this BushCo drag our country further down into the murky quagmire of Fascism and violence, taking the rest of the world with them!I have sat quietly back these past five weeks as the slaughter in Iraq sorrowfully surges along with George's bloody escalation---and as the philosophical opposition to the war has soared to almost four out of every five Americans. I have remained silent when senator Barack Obama said that impeachment is only reserved for "grave, grave" breeches! Well, BushCo has created hundreds of thousands of graves dug by their lies and greed.

For cripes' sake, George admitted to breaking the FISA Act (which is a felony) that also breeched the 4th Amendment to our Constitution that already prohibited illegal search and seizure. How was Bill Clinton's offense graver than George's, Dick's,or Scooter's? Did we ever think that the criminality and arrogance of the Nixon White House would be eclipsed in our time with nary a "baaaah" from the Sheeple in Congress?George has said that America doesn't "do torture" when we have all seen the images of torture from Abu Ghraib(don't believe your lyin' eyes) and know that hundreds of people sold to the US Army for an immoral bounty are incarcerated within the inhumane confines of Guantanamo Prison which is right in our own back yard.

I have had to bite my tongue---HARD---as the George and Dick crime cabal, (formerly known has the executive branch) have claimed that their offices are not to be held up to the same standards of accountability and control as any other entity in the human race, governmental or private.It has been recently reported that Nancy Pelosi said that impeachment is not "worth it." Her faulty reasoning is that impeachment would take too much time because they don't have the votes. If they could "whip" their own Democratic caucus into shape todefend and protect our Constitution and the people of Iraq and our soldiers as they whupped, cajoled,threatened and browbeat the caucus into attaching"non-binding" time lines onto the last war funding bill, then impeachment would not only be possible, but likely. The recent commutation of I. Scooter Libby's sentence,however, was the straw that broke my camel's back of exhausted ennui.

Patrick Fitzgerald is a thoughtful and thorough prosecutor who did a heroic job of bringing at least one of the Bush Crime Mob to justice. Even though we were all very pleased, we knew that it was not enough and that Mr. Fitzgerald would delve deeper into the feces infested executive branch.The lawlessness of the Bush Administration has reached wild west proportions and the inmates definitely have control of the US(A)sylum.

A very dear friend of mine, Rev. Lennox Yearwood of the Hip Hop Caucus, is being harassed by the Air Force for "Conduct Unbecoming an Officer and a Gentleman"because "The Rev" fulfills his duty as an Officer and a Gentleman honorably by protesting Iraq and the fascist Bush Regime almost constantly. The Rev is still in Individual Ready Reserve so the Air Force believes it is within its parameters to pursue the charges, although every "Officer and Gentleman(woman)"should be protesting the atrocious mistakes in the middle East. After The Rev's hearing on July 12th, (in Macon, GA) he is going to begin a "symbolic" walk from the Reverend Martin Luther King's grave (Atlanta, GA)to DC---I am going to be there for him and to begin the march, but I am not going to make it symbolic.We are going to walk from Atlanta, GA to Congress beginning July 13th and ending up in DC on July 23rdto send the mis-leaders back home to face the music of justice in their own districts.

It is about time us "peasants" (in the eyes of the fascist Ruling Elite) march on DC with our"pitchforks" of righteous anger and our "torches" of truth to demand the ouster of BushCo. I have a dream of the detention centers that George has built and filled being instead filled with Orange Clad neo-consand neo-connettes.If Congress won't dig BushCo's political grave, it isthe People's job to do so. Thomas Jefferson said that we need a Revolution every 20 years, or so, to keep our Republic honest. Over 225 years have passed since our last Revolution (if you don't count the war between the States) and we are long overdue for one.

Turn off your TVs, kiss your pets goodbye, bring the kids and flock to the federal seat of corruption, or join us on our walk there, for a people's accountability Movement to be in the face of the criminal BushCo and the Complicit Congress for the last week of session before they go on their undeserved vacations (why do they get vacations when the Iraqi parliamentarians don't?)On the eve of our first revolution: You know it's right!Author's note: Please, I already see "Attention whore back." If anyone thinks that I am going to walk hundreds of miles in the Deep South during July for attention, then please join us! We will be publishing our route and plans for Accountability events along the way, within the next few days. Stay tuned."

. . . . . .

You go girl!

[ETA: This site has become much more openly anti-Semitic, racist, neo-Nazi than it was 3-4 years ago when I last looked. So, I've removed the words "thinly veiled" from my original post. Please, gc, delete your post.]

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: unionist ]

It is not for you to judge and sentence any link you don't agree with. I post from all kinds of links all over the web. I may not agree with everything they print but that does not mean I am going to censor them. Bloggers and forums have had a belly full of the self rightous censoring of those who support a fascist criminal state that imprisons hundreds of thousands of Palestinian citizens behind concrete barricades and bulldozes homes and shoots people from jet planes as they please.

gc

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: greencrow ]

I challenge you to show any link or any article posted on whatreallyhappened that is white supremacist or anti black.

I have been reading Mike Rivero's whatreallyhappened for several years now along with hundreds of other blogs...I have never read anything on his website that is white supremacist or racist...he does not agree with the policies of the state of Israel, that's true. Is it a crime to disagree with the policies of the state of Israel?

Unfortunately, I see I have fallen into an age-old trap. Someone who disagrees with my point of view starts talking about Israel and anti semitism and Poof...off we go on a tangent totally unrelated to the thread under discussion.

Moderator...this is the last word you will hear from me on the subject of Israel. Promise.

gc

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: greencrow ]

An article by David Duke - ever heard of him in your conspiracy meetings, gc!?

article about "well-heeled Jewish criminals"

on and on and on and on

I am leaving these up until a moderator deletes your obscene posts, then I will delete these. This is on the off-chance that you are genuinely and totally ignorant of the content of this website and are prepared to make amends once you see the truth. It's called benefit of the doubt.

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: unionist ]

I hope the moderator takes a very good look at those links you posted.

The first one is about the irrelevance of the mainstream media...not racism.

The second one is a person rebuting something someone else said about him....not white supremacy.

The third one is a repetition of the second one (for some reason).

Yes, I do hope the moderator has the ability to see through your effort to censor discussion on this forum. Other forums have overcome this kind of pilloring and I hope this one is able to too.

Now, back to the subject of this thread...and I will not be addressing anything else on this thread other than the very urgent matter of the President of the United States interfering with the course of justice...an impeachable offense.

Many are slowly coming to the realization that Mr. Bush has finally gone too far. There seems to be a coalescing around the central issues.

Here is a good analysis by juan cole...one of my favourite bloggers, even though he has blinders on when it comes to 9/11. Here is what juan says about the commutation of Libby's sentence.

Juan Cole on the Bush interference in the course of justice

gc

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: greencrow ]

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: greencrow ]

No, I'm not ignorant and I'm not intimidated by veiled threats, either.

from therawstory.com

CNN legal analyst: 'Pardons are poison to presidents' reputations'
David Edwards and Muriel Kane
Published: Tuesday July 3, 2007

Print This Email This

"Legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin spoke with CNN on Monday about the Scooter Libby commutation, saying, "Maybe I'm just naive. I was totally shocked by this, because pardons are poison to presidents' reputations. ... And for the president to violate Justice Department guidelines ... to help a White House insider when he's helped so few other ordinary Americans in this way was just astonishing to me."

Toobin explained that although the president has the constitutional right to ignore the Justice Department guidelines, which state that commutation should be offered only after someone has served part of their sentence, he has always followed them in the past. "Whenever you go outside the guidelines, that's when you get into trouble," Toobin said.

"This was hardly some sort of Democratic operation," Toobin concluded. "Practically everyone involved in prosecuting or judging Lewis Libby was a Republican."

. . . .

Yes...I feel a trend coming on...I love the smell of impeachment hearings in the morning.

gc

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: greencrow ]

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2007/jul2007/libb-j04.shtml

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The decision of the Bush White House to commute the jail sentence of Vice President Dick Cheney’s former chief of staff I. Lewis “Scooter” Libby is a telling demonstration of both the criminal character of the US government and the inequality that pervades American society.

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The reason Libby’s prosecution has turned into a cause célèbre for this socio-political layer is that the lies he told federal investigators were part of a conspiracy to cover up far bigger lies that were used to drag the American people into a criminal war launched to further the profit interests of the corporate elite.

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In the final analysis, Libby’s real crime is not that he lied about matters related to the exposure of a single CIA operative, though leading Democrats have welcomed this issue as a chance to portray Republicans as “traitors” and enemies of national security. Rather, the crime Libby, Cheney and the rest committed and then sought to defend in the Plame-Wilson matter was the promotion of an illegal war based upon lies.

Behind the muted response is undoubtedly an element of “there but for the grace of God go I” from co-participants in the corrupt and criminal activities of the US government. They, after all, work in the same protected and privileged bubble as Libby and his associates.

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There is an additional social and political dynamic at work here. Within the entire political and media establishment there is a firm conviction that the savage “criminal justice” system in the US is not meant for possessors of wealth and purveyors of power such as Libby. Prisons and harsh sentences are in place to suppress and control the masses of poor and working people.

The number of prisoners in America has reached a record 2,245,000, the largest for any nation on earth and nearly 40 percent higher than its closest competitor, China. Last year, the US prison system recorded the biggest increase in the number of inmates since 2000, the Justice Department reported last week. The rise was attributed largely to mandatory sentencing laws, which the administration has sought to toughen still further, while overriding just such a statute in the Libby case.

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The crime of which Libby is guilty—as are Bush, Cheney and others in the military and political establishment—is the same one which formed the principal charge against the Nazi defendants at Nuremberg 60 years ago: conspiracy to wage a war of aggression.

That Libby cannot be punished, even for the tangential offenses of obstructing justice and lying under oath, demonstrates that the entire political establishment, including the Democrats and the media, is implicated in the same underlying crime

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Originally posted by unionist:

What I still don't understand is why the Libby case is significant. Call me dense, please, but spell it out for me.

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: unionist ]

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The significance of this is the blatantly self serving aspect. All of the other things Cheney/Bush (got to get the order right here ) have done have had a fig leaf of justification, mostly the "War on Terror". In this case, no justification at all. In fact, not even the appearance of consulting with the Justice Department.

The level of the crime is relatively low, but that may only be because some of the other crimes are so monstrous.

It's important because it's clear.

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Originally posted by jrootham:
How's that for an explanation?

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Originally posted by greencrow:
unionist

I hope the moderator takes a very good look at those links you posted.

The first one is about the irrelevance of the mainstream media...not racism.

The second one is a person rebuting something someone else said about him....not white supremacy.

The third one is a repetition of the second one (for some reason).

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The first is one of Curt's trademarked rants. Just another stream on conciousness free for all of facts, supsicions and myths. Is it about the irrelevance of the mainstream media? Thank you for bothering to read it all and figure it out. My head was spinning after the first paragraph.

The second starts out ok, and as usual Duke makes some strong points. This time about the qualifiers that get appended to his name as a means of discrediting him. He claims that these are ad hominem blandishments more or less. Good enough, even David Duke is capable of learning and even deconstructing ideology in the media - Foucault would be proud.

That said, he then descends into the very kind of anti-Jewish smear-job, based on ridiculous stereotypes about the "Jewish" media, and all of those things show that the blandishments are not actually ad hominem at all and actually accurate descriptors of his racist antisemitism.

You are right though, it is not about "White supremacy," it is largely about David Dukes theories about the "Jewish conspiracy."

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Read Jewish Supremacism again; read the last two chapters on Jewish-led immigration policies and the Jewish worldwide threat. If this becomes common knowledge across the world, a great blow will have been struck not only in the battle of these independent nations against Jewish supremacy, but also in our own homelands.

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He couldn't even hang onto the practice of using the word Zionist, instead of Jew, to cover up his racism for a whole article. There it is: "the Jewish media..." "...Jewish supremacy..." the "...Jewish-led immigration policies..." the "...Jewish worldwide threat...."

To go back to Dukes original point: "CNN also labels me a "former Klansman," but for some reason or other the media don't label George Bush as a "former cokehead," by the same token, why does Duke feel compelled call it the "Jewish" media when he means the Israeli media, and not to say the "Arab" media, when he is quoting the "Arab" media -- that is the "non-Jewish media" according to Duke.

Hmmmm... interesting... not really.

I didn't bother to read the third.

If saying that required that I be on the same thread as the noxious Jeff House then so be it.

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: Cueball ]

Anyway, back on topic.
Im surprised that people dont see this self-serving pardon as the final blow to Bush presidential credibility.(Not like he ever had any credibility overseas, and among educated ppl, but im talking about USians). This mega-slimy move will be worse for him than the Nixon pardon was for Jerry Ford, considering how many other dirty blunders the "Decider" was involved in.

"...I must say I'm finished with this thread until either greencrow's neo-nazi shit is expunged from here, or s/he is, or both.

. . . . .

So now the fact that I used a link from a website unionist doesn't like... makes me a

booga boooga boooooooga neo-nazi.

Well, just so long as s/he keeps her/his promise to quit this thread....

Thanks for your comments, Cueball.

gc

[ 03 July 2007: Message edited by: greencrow ]

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Originally posted by BetterRed:
Hmmm,
A Cueball sighting!
Welcome back man,

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quote:

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Originally posted by Cueball:
Hi. Its just a raid.

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