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Author Topic: Organizing an outsourced call center
enemy_of_capital
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posted 18 October 2008 08:03 AM      Profile for enemy_of_capital     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I work at a call center in Mississauga that fields calls for a U.S. Cell phone provider, among other call in companies based in the U.s. and Canada. I have found that we are treated rather poorly with random deductions from our checks (supposed "hours missed") and continually rising hours of work and little prospects for a raise and almost nil job security. I want to organize the work place as it is ripe for it (people seem to be game) but I've never done this befor I attempted to email out the relevant unions and federations of labour and got no response. Suggestions from those who know better than I?
From: Mississauga | Registered: Sep 2008  |  IP: Logged
N.Beltov
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posted 18 October 2008 09:09 AM      Profile for N.Beltov   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Try The Troublemaker's Handbook.

Union organizing and the Internet

Reply to Eric Lee

There are plenty of resources out there. And there are plenty for the bosses as well. Be warned.


From: Vancouver Island | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
abnormal
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posted 18 October 2008 11:33 AM      Profile for abnormal   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
One question I think you should find out the answer to. What exactly is the legal relationship between your call centre and the US entity you're servicing?

If it's purely a contractual one it's probable that your actual employer can't pass any cost increases along and it's the easiest thing in the world for the company to terminate the contract.


From: far, far away | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
enemy_of_capital
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posted 18 October 2008 11:41 AM      Profile for enemy_of_capital     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
It is contractual.
From: Mississauga | Registered: Sep 2008  |  IP: Logged
unionist
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posted 18 October 2008 12:13 PM      Profile for unionist     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by abnormal:
One question I think you should find out the answer to. What exactly is the legal relationship between your call centre and the US entity you're servicing?

Who cares? Any employer that can't afford to exist with a union on the premises should go set up in some less civilized country, such as the U.S. They should pack up and leave with Wal-Mart and other low-life phoney "providers" of employment. No one needs those jobs. There are jobs aplenty without them.


From: Vote QS! | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
enemy_of_capital
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posted 18 October 2008 01:29 PM      Profile for enemy_of_capital     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I appreciate your vigor but not so in fascist Ontario friend. Viva Quebec for its closer to sane labour policies, not to make light fo your struggles to achieve these norms. jobs that pay like this one ($12.20 per hour to start) are few and far between in Greater Toronto Area.
From: Mississauga | Registered: Sep 2008  |  IP: Logged
triciamarie
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posted 18 October 2008 06:39 PM      Profile for triciamarie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
There's a story in "Our Times" labour magazine from February this year about a call centre that successfully organized in BC. They worked on contracts too.

quote:
This was a third-party call centre, where they contract work from major corporations which they call "projects." Individual employees work pretty much exclusively on a particular project. As organizers we tried to focus in on small inside committees from each project. There were some very dedicated inside committee members who saw the benefit of bringing a union in.

This was a very anti-union employer. The market for this kind of work is strictly driven by outside contracts, so the rate of pay is governed by the market and, when you're competing with workers in Indonesia and India and other parts of the world where wages are significantly lower, that's what's continually thrown at the workers. They say, "We can flip a switch and all your calls will go to Indonesia where we only pay a dollar an hour or a day." So there's that constant threat.


http://www.ourtimes.ca/Talking/printer_68.php

The biggest problem with organizing a lot of these kinds of places is the high turnover; the call centre in this story was looking at 90% turnover a year. Frankly that's why it can be hard to spark much of an interest from the big unions.


From: gwelf | Registered: Jul 2006  |  IP: Logged
unionist
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posted 18 October 2008 08:15 PM      Profile for unionist     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by enemy_of_capital:
jobs that pay like this one ($12.20 per hour to start) are few and far between in Greater Toronto Area.

I understand that. Québec is not better. My point is this: In deciding whether or not to launch an organizing drive, I believe it is very wrong to take into consideration whether the employer will shut the place down. That's what Wal-Mart wants workers to think.

Just go ahead and find a way to unionize the place. If it closes, there are other jobs. Yes, there are. But if you fear the closure more than you fear workers' fate when facing the boss individually, there are no other chances in life. Take the chance. If you're lucky enough to find a union that will sponsor the effort, that is...


From: Vote QS! | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
triciamarie
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posted 19 October 2008 06:14 PM      Profile for triciamarie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
In the interim it may also be worth your while checking out the Workers Action Centre, a community resource for non-unionized, low-paid workers. They have a telephone inquiry line to answer employment-related questions. They might have some suggestions for you and your coworkers about getting paid what you're owed.

http://www.workersactioncentre.org/who.htm

There are also some bulletins on the website you could distribute or post anonymously.

Careful though, because outside of a formal organizing drive, you're not protected from recrimination by the employer. The employer will have you in their sights if they clue into what you're doing.


From: gwelf | Registered: Jul 2006  |  IP: Logged
enemy_of_capital
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posted 19 October 2008 09:33 PM      Profile for enemy_of_capital     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
There's a story in "Our Times" labour magazine from February this year about a call centre that successfully organized in BC. They worked on contracts too.

quote:This was a third-party call centre, where they contract work from major corporations which they call "projects." Individual employees work pretty much exclusively on a particular project. As organizers we tried to focus in on small inside committees from each project. There were some very dedicated inside committee members who saw the benefit of bringing a union in.

This was a very anti-union employer. The market for this kind of work is strictly driven by outside contracts, so the rate of pay is governed by the market and, when you're competing with workers in Indonesia and India and other parts of the world where wages are significantly lower, that's what's continually thrown at the workers. They say, "We can flip a switch and all your calls will go to Indonesia where we only pay a dollar an hour or a day." So there's that constant threat.

http://www.ourtimes.ca/Talking/printer_68.php

The biggest problem with organizing a lot of these kinds of places is the high turnover; the call centre in this story was looking at 90% turnover a year. Frankly that's why it can be hard to spark much of an interest from the big unions.


This is dead on I'm afraid. I am organizing a guerilla town hall when a large number of us are not working and trying to organize the whole thing off premises I think. but is this legal?


From: Mississauga | Registered: Sep 2008  |  IP: Logged
Doug
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posted 19 October 2008 11:15 PM      Profile for Doug   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
You certainly can do it - just don't expect any miracles. Call centres are an extremely competitive business because it can be done just about anywhere in the world and it's easy for companies needing those services to shop around for the best deal. This has a big effect, even with a union in place.

My employer has that rare thing, unionized call centres. It also outsources a portion of that work to a call centre provider in India. On a day-to-day basis, that call centre is almost more trouble than it's worth - customers don't like it and they don't do the quality of work one would hope for. They are, however, cheap - costing per call around a fifth of what the local call centres do. It shouldn't take a genius then to realize why recent collective agreements have been less than generous to the call centre workers.


From: Toronto, Canada | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
arthur seaton
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posted 29 October 2008 12:22 PM      Profile for arthur seaton     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Call Centres have been organised, some outsourced centres others in house.
I wouldn't expect much from e-mailing various unions. One thing you can do is call up the CLC organising dept. or the local labour council and ask them to put you in touch with unions that have organised call centres in the past or have that area of work undere their "jurisdiction".

You will be taken more seriously if you have formed quietly a committee of co-workers who want to take the lead on this.

The idea of doing a town hall outside of work is a good one, but I wouldn't spread the word far and wide. Instead I would invite somethe co-workers you trust and have had a chance to suss out on the idea of a union.

From there you can begin to identify the issues people want resovled and how forming a union can deal with some of those problems.

Secondly you might want to find a way of getting a list of employees and if possible their phone numbers and address - sometimes there is one laying around. In other instances workers have done a raffle for something and sold tickets for 1 or 2 dollars and gotten names and addresses that way. i would do this before launching anything as management tend to get very suspicious once they know that people are trying to organise.

i would also try to have your committee talk to a few unions, and make sure that they are going to back you up on your work to organise. make sure you ask what strategies they employ, how do they test people for support. Many unions just get you to sign cards and then file, this has an incredibly low success rate in the service sector.

Also ask how they will help you deal with what is called third partying the union. Most employers will fight the attempt to get a union by making it appear that the union is completely and outside entity, and many unions fall into that with their literature and how they talk about the union.

Good luck.


From: toronto | Registered: Oct 2008  |  IP: Logged
TVParkdale
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posted 29 October 2008 01:36 PM      Profile for TVParkdale     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by enemy_of_capital:
I work at a call center in Mississauga that fields calls for a U.S. Cell phone provider, among other call in companies based in the U.s. and Canada. I have found that we are treated rather poorly with random deductions from our checks (supposed "hours missed") and continually rising hours of work and little prospects for a raise and almost nil job security. I want to organize the work place as it is ripe for it (people seem to be game) but I've never done this befor I attempted to email out the relevant unions and federations of labour and got no response. Suggestions from those who know better than I?

Get some advice from this group:
Small Union SIEU
They have deep pockets and will work with smaller groups and are looking for more members.


From: DaHood | Registered: Oct 2008  |  IP: Logged
It's Me D
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posted 30 October 2008 11:51 AM      Profile for It's Me D     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Having worked many of Halifax's plentiful private sector non-union call centers I was shocked to experience the difference when working for the public sector unionized call center operated by the HRM; the level of respect from the employer was worlds above what I'd grown used to (that and the pay). I'm not sure how much of this came from the union and how much from the fact that it is a public sector employer; the two often go hand-in-hand it seems. Anyway I have no relevant advice for you (sorry); it is quite a challenge you are facing and I just wanted to say that if your efforts can achieve the sort of change I saw when moving (myself) from a non-unionized to a unionized call center then they are absolutely worthwhile.
From: Parrsboro, NS | Registered: Apr 2008  |  IP: Logged
munroe
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posted 31 October 2008 06:33 AM      Profile for munroe     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I had involvement in the organising drive referred to in Our Times. It was a tough, lengthy and expensive matter. The Collective Agreement now in place for more than a year is not the best money wise, but the presence of the Union has brought dignity and respect to the workplace.

In Ontario, I know that Steel made an attempt similar to ours at a call centre in Thunder Bay. No idea whether they are still interested.


From: Port Moody, B.C. | Registered: Jun 2007  |  IP: Logged
triciamarie
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posted 31 October 2008 10:32 AM      Profile for triciamarie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Kudos to you guys, munroe. This is the future of unions -- I hope.

quote:
Originally posted by It's Me D:
the level of respect from the employer was worlds above what I'd grown used to (that and the pay). I'm not sure how much of this came from the union and how much from the fact that it is a public sector employer; the two often go hand-in-hand it seems

It's wonderful that public sector unions have come so far in the past 30 - 40 years that not only is there such a high rate of unionization, it's even hard to even remember the fight that government workers waged against their employer to acquire the basic legal right to bargain collectively.


From: gwelf | Registered: Jul 2006  |  IP: Logged
It's Me D
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posted 31 October 2008 11:31 AM      Profile for It's Me D     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
It's wonderful that public sector unions have come so far in the past 30 - 40 years that not only is there such a high rate of unionization, it's even hard to even remember the fight that government workers waged against their employer to acquire the basic legal right to bargain collectively.

I agree its a good situation but on a less heartening note new public sector managers are still being trained to view public sector unions as the enemy; I can attest to being one of less than a half-dozen students in Dalhousie's Masters of Public Administration program who voiced any dissent regarding this position. I guess thats to be expected but how wonderful it would be if young hopeful public sector managers were not being spoiled on unions even before they have any personal experience with them.


From: Parrsboro, NS | Registered: Apr 2008  |  IP: Logged
triciamarie
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posted 31 October 2008 06:53 PM      Profile for triciamarie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I note in this old thread from 2003, CUPW was signing cards at a CIBC call centre.

http://tinyurl.com/5uzwrd


From: gwelf | Registered: Jul 2006  |  IP: Logged

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