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Author Topic: Supreme Court will hear Wal-Mart workers' case
Doug
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posted 07 August 2008 09:09 AM      Profile for Doug   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
The Supreme Court of Canada has agreed to hear appeals from a number of workers who lost their jobs when Wal-mart Canada closed its unionized store in Saguenay, Que., three years ago.

As is usual, the court gave no reasons for its decision to consider the two related cases, and no date has been set for the hearing.

The United Food and Commercial Workers Union won certification at the Wal Mart outlet in September, 2004, but could not reach a contract agreement with the retail giant.

The union asked to take the matter to arbitration, but Wal-Mart then announced it was closing the store.


I won't hold my breath waiting for it, but it would be nice if Wal-Mart got smacked on this one


From: Toronto, Canada | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
N.Beltov
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posted 07 August 2008 09:37 AM      Profile for N.Beltov   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I rather suspect that the Court will allow Wal-Mart to continue to carry on its anti-union policies, such as closing stores that unionize. If Wal-Mart claims that such a store lost money, and therefore needed to be closed, what chance do the victims of Wal-Mart have to prove otherwise? Just as employers have a million ways to get rid of somebody they don't like, so too employers have a million ways to justify anti-union policies by reference to all sorts of fictional "operational" reasons.

But perhaps I am jumping the gun. The court may come to discover the obvious; that an abstract "right" to belong to a union is pointless if any employer can subvert that right with the most flimsy and bogus justifications that cannot be challenged by the union members.

OTOH, a clear ruling against the union members, and in favor of Wal-Mart and "property rights" might be just the sort of ruling needed to demonstrate once and for all that capitalism is incompatible with the rights of working people and that, therefore, socialism or something like that is essential for society to move forward. That too is a kind of victory if workers in their millions come to see the truth that even in the most "liberal" of capitalist democracies their rights are often little more than paper proclamations. In that case, a conservative institution like the Supreme Court can contribute to fundamental social change of the most radical kind.

[ 07 August 2008: Message edited by: N.Beltov ]


From: Vancouver Island | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
Boom Boom
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posted 07 August 2008 11:44 AM      Profile for Boom Boom     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Maybe one way to shut down WalMart is to keep trying to unionize every one of their stores, and let the corporation shut down every store that does get union vertification. It'd suck, royally, to lose all those jobs, but competitors would rise from WalMart's ashes.
From: Make the rich pay! | Registered: Dec 2004  |  IP: Logged
robbie_dee
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posted 07 August 2008 12:07 PM      Profile for robbie_dee     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The problem of course is that when Walmart workers perceive a credible threat by Walmart to shut down their store in response to unionizing, those workers (who would like a union but would also like to keep their jobs) become less willing to unionize. So at the cost of giving up on a few markets, like the Saguenay, Walmart gains the use of a huge club with which to beat down all their other workers.

Hopefully the Supreme Court will consider this fact and adopt a more nuanced reading of the law beyond simly saying that an employer has an absolute right to close down its business, consequences be damned.


From: Iron City | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Mojoroad1
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posted 07 August 2008 12:10 PM      Profile for Mojoroad1     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
It'd suck, royally, to lose all those jobs...

You mean the minimum wage/no benefit service industry jobs brought to you by corporate mega-stores that kill local economy/jobs????

I think you're right: keep on unionizing the retail/ service sector. Seeing as our provincial Govm'ts seem not very interested in raising the minimum wage to anywhere near the poverty line,
I hope the supreme court does do the right thing on this.... the Walmarts/ McDonalds etc. in Canada cannot continue to shut down and open up across the street whenever an enlightened group in Windsor/Quebec/Canada certifies a union.


From: Muskoka | Registered: Aug 2008  |  IP: Logged
N.Beltov
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posted 07 August 2008 12:36 PM      Profile for N.Beltov   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
robbie_dee: Hopefully the Supreme Court will consider this fact and adopt a more nuanced reading of the law beyond simply saying that an employer has an absolute right to close down its business, consequences be damned.

I should have added to my remarks that whatever the court decides, it would be great to read their reasoning. But I am not sure that the Supreme Court has to provide reasons for all of its decisions.


From: Vancouver Island | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
Robespierre
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posted 07 August 2008 12:50 PM      Profile for Robespierre     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Things work differently in Canada. For example, In the U.S., Santa Claus has nine reindeer but in Canada there are nine Santas without any reindeer.

On the other hand, the high court in the U.S. does provide the reasoning behind findings, however, it usually defies common sense and all logic.


From: Raccoons at my door! | Registered: Jul 2008  |  IP: Logged
pookie
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posted 07 August 2008 12:55 PM      Profile for pookie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by N.Beltov:

But I am not sure that the Supreme Court has to provide reasons for all of its decisions.


It doesn't have to issue reasons (no high court does, really) but it almost invariably does as a matter of meeting legitimate expectations. The only routine exception is in some criminal appeals where leave is not required and the Court says "We agree with the lower court or judge X or whatever".


From: there's no "there" there | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
unionist
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posted 07 August 2008 12:59 PM      Profile for unionist     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by N.Beltov:

I should have added to my remarks that whatever the court decides, it would be great to read their reasoning. But I am not sure that the Supreme Court has to provide reasons for all of its decisions.


The Supreme Court doesn't have to give reasons for denying or granting leave to appeal, but it will invariably give decisions in a case like this one. Otherwise, there's little point in even hearing this appeal.


From: Vote QS! | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
Robo
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posted 07 August 2008 01:12 PM      Profile for Robo     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by N.Beltov:

But I am not sure that the Supreme Court has to provide reasons for all of its decisions.

Feel free to look here to spend as many days or weeks as you would like to read the reasons that the Supremes give for each of their decisions on the substance of every issue they adjudicate. (They don't give reasons on what they choose to hear and not hear -- that's better described as administrative than substantial, IMHO.) There's no charge to access the web site, which has all of the Supremes' decisions since 1967.

[ 07 August 2008: Message edited by: Robo ]


From: East York | Registered: Jun 2003  |  IP: Logged
robbie_dee
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posted 07 August 2008 01:20 PM      Profile for robbie_dee     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
One factor that will be interesting is to see how the Supreme Court squares this situation with its prior decision in I.A.T.S.E., Stage Local 56 v. Société de la Place des Arts de Montréal, 2004 SCC 2 (CanLII).

In that decision, Justice Gonthier held that under Quebec law, an employer has "the right" to go out of business either in whole or in part. He approvingly cited an earlier decision of Judge Marc Lesage in City Buick Pontiac (Montréal) Inc. v. Roy, [1981] T.T. 22 (L.C.), where that judge held: "If an employer, for whatever reason, decides as a result to actually close up shop, the dismissals which follow are the result of ceasing operations, which is a valid economic reason not to hire personnel, even if the cessation is based on socially reprehensible considerations." Based on this reasoning, Gonthier rejected the union's submission that the Place des Arts did not shut down its technical services in a genuine and bona fide manner. Even if the employer's reasons had been to thwart the union, Gonthier held, this was allowed provided that the employer "carried out the decision genuinely and did not merely engage in an elaborate sham to break the employees' strike."

I think this was a terrible decision. What will be interesting to see is if the Supreme Court is also reconsidering it in light of its later ruling that collective bargaining is a constitutional right. (See Health Services and Support – Facilities Subsector Bargaining Assn. v. British Columbia, [2007] 2 S.C.R. 391). Does an employer's "right" to close its business, where that right is exercised with a clear intent to undermine union organizing, trump employees' constitutional right to free collective bargaining? We shall see.

[ 09 August 2008: Message edited by: robbie_dee ]


From: Iron City | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
N.Beltov
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posted 07 August 2008 01:23 PM      Profile for N.Beltov   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well, that's good news - I think. (Robo's remark that the reasoning behind the decisions are available.)

[ 07 August 2008: Message edited by: N.Beltov ]


From: Vancouver Island | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
robbie_dee
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posted 09 August 2008 06:04 AM      Profile for robbie_dee     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Union Leaders expect Wal-Mart to shut down another operation in Quebec when they get a contract

quote:
Union leaders say they expect Wal-Mart Canada Corp. to shut down a garage it operates in Gatineau, Que., after workers are presented with their first collective agreement.

Guy Chenier, president of the union local representing auto-service specialists at the garage, said Wal-Mart has already hinted it would close the shop.

In 2005, Wal-Mart came under fire for closing a store in Jonquiere, Que., after workers won union accreditation.

In Gatineau, across the river from Ottawa, Wal-Mart garage workers have been unionized since 2005 and are now waiting for their first collective agreement following binding arbitration that ended in June.

It's not clear when the contract will be imposed, but the union says it expects it soon.

The contract will be a first in North America and is expected to have an impact on Wal-Mart unionization efforts across Canada.

"I have the impression that they will want to close the garage," said Chenier, president of local 486 of the United Food and Commercial Workers Canada. "But if they do this, we will help the workers find other places right away."

"If this had been a regular file we would have had a collective agreement in 2005," he added. "A few years later we wouldn't even be talking about it anymore."

At stake are salaries and benefits. On average, workers at the Gatineau garage earn $9.25 an hour.

A Wal-Mart executive has already said the retailer might be forced to close the garage, depending on what's in the agreement, said Louis Bolduc, a UFCW spokesperson in Quebec.

"We are eager to see how Wal-Mart behaves," Bolduc said.

"We hope they will act like good corporate citizens."

Yanik Deschenes, a spokesperson for Wal-Mart in Quebec, said the retailer could only comment on the arbitrator's decision when it's announced.

"The arbitrator is now working on the file, so we cannot speculate on the outcome," he said. "We respect the process and we want to wait for the decision."



From: Iron City | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
N.Beltov
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posted 09 August 2008 08:44 AM      Profile for N.Beltov   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
It could be a very smart move for Wal-mart's competitors in Canada to donate HUGE sums of money to unions organizing there. So far, this seems to be the most "successful" way to put Wal-mart out of business. Orthodox business strategies don't seem to be working.

All the stores at once? It's an idea.


From: Vancouver Island | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
Boom Boom
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posted 09 August 2008 03:04 PM      Profile for Boom Boom     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
It's the only way I can see to drive WalMart out, if they're not willing to unionize.
From: Make the rich pay! | Registered: Dec 2004  |  IP: Logged
Kdrunkin1
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posted 13 August 2008 05:56 PM      Profile for Kdrunkin1     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by N.Beltov:
It could be a very smart move for Wal-mart's competitors in Canada to donate HUGE sums of money to unions organizing there. So far, this seems to be the most "successful" way to put Wal-mart out of business. Orthodox business strategies don't seem to be working.

All the stores at once? It's an idea.


Is this not some sort of extortion that you are hoping to have happen? What would you say if Walmart donated large sums of money to decertify union shops?


From: SE Sask | Registered: Oct 2007  |  IP: Logged
Timebandit
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posted 13 August 2008 09:10 PM      Profile for Timebandit     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by N.Beltov:
It could be a very smart move for Wal-mart's competitors in Canada to donate HUGE sums of money to unions organizing there. So far, this seems to be the most "successful" way to put Wal-mart out of business. Orthodox business strategies don't seem to be working.

All the stores at once? It's an idea.


There are two problems with that scenario.

First off, Wal-Mart has only closed one store due to union activity. All other union drives have succumbed to other tactics, save the meat cutters in the US who unionized and had their department shut down. This is why, to this day, Wal-Mart has only pre-packaged meat in their grocery operations.

Secondly, most of the other retailers are also non-union and don't have any more interest in becoming unionized than Wal-Mart does. They are no better, just smaller.

I made a documentary on Wal-Mart and unions a little over a year ago, and learned a lot about retail in general, Wal-Mart in specific and also the UFCW. There are no white hats.

(Now back to packing -- out of town for a couple of days...)


From: Urban prairie. | Registered: Sep 2001  |  IP: Logged
Bärlüer
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posted 16 October 2008 11:12 AM      Profile for Bärlüer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
And so it happened:

Wal-Mart closes shop where union contract imposed


From: Montreal | Registered: Aug 2007  |  IP: Logged
Lard Tunderin' Jeezus
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posted 16 October 2008 11:19 AM      Profile for Lard Tunderin' Jeezus   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I'd say it's time to jail the executive board of Walmart Canada for contempt of court.
From: ... | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged

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